FOX News.

[Malcolm Wright]

It depends on who's doing the manipulating. Some comes from sources who would spur us to work for the common good. Too many others do it to achieve ends that are only for their own selfish good at the expense of others. With your educational dysfunction as a backdrop, not enough people can distinguish between the two and therein lies the danger and my disgust at the practice.

My feelings exactly.

[garyd]

Fox is outrageous to the extent you tilt to the left. Boo and Chach lean so far to the left they likely roll rather than walk.

[Freedom&Liberty]

So in other words, you have no idea what my "sources" are, but you're sure they just must be bad, since I'm not a dittohead. After all, if I were using the "right" sources, I'd be just as brainwashed as you. Right?

Get over yourself. It doesn't matter what your sources are. The only difference is that you're as brainwashed as the DNC wants you to be.

That's an interesting perspective that has some merit. FOX is so outrageous with its opinions that it might make it easier to distinguish them from the news. However that's not FOX's intention: they are manifestly out to deceive as evidenced in instances of falsified reports and in the name 'fair and balanced', when their approach is anything but.

Unfortunately, I think you overestimate the general population. YOU may be able to distinguish between news and opinion on FOX, but most people can't. Studies have actually demonstrated that those who get their news from FOX have higher rates of confusion over basic facts.

M.

Fox is no worse that left leaning outlets. Every outlet injects bias into it's reporting. You may not like the message that Fox puts out, but that doesn't make it any more pervasive than the massively larger and more pervasive liberal MSM. You're just so used to hearing the lefty message that you can't distinguish it from the truth anymore. Bigger is not better and the common good is just as selfish..

[Malcolm Wright]

Fox is no worse that left leaning outlets. Every outlet injects bias into it's reporting. You may not like the message that Fox puts out, but that doesn't make it any more pervasive than the massively larger and more pervasive liberal MSM. You're just so used to hearing the lefty message that you can't distinguish it from the truth anymore. Bigger is not better and the common good is just as selfish..

Maybe I am brain-washed: I wouldn't necessarily know it if I was. But one thing seems to be objective in all this: Fox is quite a bit worse than the left-leaning outlets. Deliberate falsehoods appear in their reports more often. So in terms of deliberate deception they appear to be worse, although in terms of bias, they may not be any more extreme than the left leaning ones. But that says something: their message is probably more extreme if they need to deceive more often.

M.

[garyd]

No, what you have been taught to believe is a lie, often it appears. What you wish to believe to be is a lie often appears. Even if you are wrong it isn't necessarily a lie if you believed what you said to be the truth at the time you said it.

Governments by their very nature are coercive endeavors. Taking from a and giving to b by force of law or at the point of a gun does not promote the general welfare which is why governments should be kept out of the charity business.

[hadit]

Baloney. hadit and a few other rightwingers ont he board recently admitted they listen to Rush. When advertisers started pulling ads from his show, every rightwinger I know was frantic and frankly terrified. Without Rush, they won't know what to think.

They weren't on here. Every rightwinger on DA that bothered to comment on it correctly predicted Rush would not only do fine, but would actually prosper from the incident. It was the feckless left that hilariously got all worked up thinking they would finally be rid of him.

[BooRadley]

feckless

Channelling John McCain so soon?

What disturbs me most about this kind of tactic is that its users realize that deception is the only way to get what they want. Their goals have so little merit they can't achieve them honorably. That hardly strikes me as consistent with our democratic tradition.

They think people aren't smart enough to know what's good for them. Seriously. They'll never admit it in public, but get some of them in a private conversation and they'll tell you directly.

I first noticed that strategy with George Bush's speeches. After 9/11 almost every mention he made of it was coupled with mention of Saddam Hussein. He never said Saddam had anything to do with the attacks, yet he frequently made mention of one whenever he talked about the other. The effect? We he got carte blanche to invade Iraq.

They were using every trick in the book. For example, Dubya would say "the terrorists" this and "the terrorists" that, talking about al Qaida, then say, "We know Saddam Hussein has given money to the terrorists", talking about a different group, but not telling his little followers.

Totally disgusting. And a complete disaster, nonetheless.

[jwreck]

I was watching off-and-on all day today. Aside from the obvious, a "panel of experts" trying to find the answer to the question "who really is Barak Obama". It was a bunch of right-wing shouting heads, but they were trying to present it as an investigative council of professional. But, more subtly, throughout the day they kept making statements that Vietnam was nearly a victory, but after Congress de-funded it and troops were pulled, it suddenly turned to a loss, and it was a tragic shame and never should have happened. Also throughout the day, they kept making statements that there are similarities between Vietnam and Afghanistan.

They're trying to lead their viewers to the conclusion that Obama is going to ruin Afghanistan . . . zOMG JSUT LIEK VIATNAM!!!!!111

That's the kind of stuff that's interesting. It was clearly scripted to be peppered throughout the day on various shows, not directly telling their audience what they're supposed to think, just paving the way for them to come to the conclusion that the GOP wants them to. That way, the sheep think they've "decided" that for themselves.

I bet it's echoed on blogs throughout the right-wing echoweb.

Hate to tell you but Fox news didn't come up with the Vietnam comparison. Its been there since a few months after we invaded. It was there for Iraq alos.

[caddis]

I'm looking for what it is that makes almost all Fox views think, talk, and behave in almost identical ways . . . all of which generally contradict reality. I'm not really concerned that much with marketing jingles, but with the propaganda mechanisms they're using.

For those views, you will have to go straight to the source:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/
http://www.democraticunderground.com/
http://www.rockthevote.com/rtv_voter...e=googleobama2
http://www.barackobama.com/
http://www.whitehouse.gov/

[Chachma v'Oz]

They think people aren't smart enough to know what's good for them. Seriously. They'll never admit it in public, but get some of them in a private conversation and they'll tell you directly.

Tell me about it. I spent 25 years in that club and was privy to all the asides and jokes at the expense of those they really look down on. It was distasteful when the party was moderate right, insufferable as it moved farther and farther to the right wing fringe and realized it had to resort to deception to attain its goals. The GOP has forfeited its legitimacy over the past 20 years by embracing its worst.

[garyd]

Yet for pure unadulterated arrogance you can't beat the modern American left. They gave us the corporate state and companies too big to fail and then blame it all on republicans whoargued against it. 2/3 of the people in the damn country clubs you hate donate to Democrats and run on the Democratic ticket.

[Chachma v'Oz]

Yet for pure unadulterated arrogance you can't beat the modern American left. They gave us the corporate state and companies too big to fail and then blame it all on republicans whoargued against it. 2/3 of the people in the damn country clubs you hate donate to Democrats and run on the Democratic ticket.

Ah, another tactic - trolling.

[Archaix]

Yet for pure unadulterated arrogance you can't beat the modern American left.

Have you ever read anything by Powerboss, Caddis or Freedom&Liberty? What about that recent shameful occasion where Hadit lied about Obama's energy policy, and then refused to retract his statements or apologise for them when I showed them for what they were?

[caddis]

Have you ever read anything by Powerboss, Caddis or Freedom&Liberty?

asphinctersezwat

[hadit]

Have you ever read anything by Powerboss, Caddis or Freedom&Liberty? What about that recent shameful occasion where Hadit lied about Obama's energy policy, and then refused to retract his statements or apologise for them when I showed them for what they were?

No lies were utilized. Obama's energy policy is a dismal failure, and we will see the results of it in our energy costs.

[Archaix]

You lied, or were yourself misled, about what his enegy policy actually was. There's no need to refute it -I proved it, and if you click on the link you can read it.

How ironic that we have a moderator whose own posts are worthless spam.

[hadit]

You lied, or were yourself misled, about what his enegy policy actually was. There's no need to refute it -I proved it, and if you click on the link you can read it.

How ironic that we have a moderator whose own posts are worthless spam.

None of what you said disproves what I said. He did clamp down on what I said he clamped down on. The fact that he backed off slightly in no way negates any of that. He has not adopted a pro-energy stance and most public lands remain off limits for even exploration to find out what may be under them.

[Freedom&Liberty]

Maybe I am brain-washed: I wouldn't necessarily know it if I was. But one thing seems to be objective in all this: Fox is quite a bit worse than the left-leaning outlets. Deliberate falsehoods appear in their reports more often. So in terms of deliberate deception they appear to be worse, although in terms of bias, they may not be any more extreme than the left leaning ones. But that says something: their message is probably more extreme if they need to deceive more often.

M.

Just because you don't like the message or George Soros started a website about it. doesn't prove it's deception. Face it, you don't really know what the truth is, so you continue to believe that your sources are golden simply because they say things you want to believe.

[Chachma v'Oz]

... you continue to believe that your sources are golden simply because they say things you want to believe.

Thank you for reminded us that this thread is about Fox News.

[Freedom&Liberty]

It's every media outlet on the planet. We believe the source that tells us what we want to hear.