Oh, no...Obama's Birth Cert is actually FAKED. I'm CONVINCED!!

[optimus]

Keep smoking it as it will help you continue to believe that Barry's BC is real! LOL

You are a first class imbecile.

[food4thought]

Physically it may not be that addictive, at least compared to other drugs. But psychologically it is, even if users don't want to admit that.

I do agree with you on that.

[Freedom&Liberty]

I love how you say that as if you're some sort of an expert. Nope, marijuana is not psychologically addictive. I haven't smoked it in about 4 years. No cravings either.

Maybe if you blazed up a little more often, that stick up your ass would fall out.

[lily]

I love how you say that as if you're some sort of an expert.

I'm not an expert and didn't claim to be. I did study addictions, addictive behavior and the root causes in a class I took a few years ago. But I think it's common knowledge that marijuana is psychologically addictive - as many other things are. I'm not trying to single it out as worse than other drugs or behaviors, btw.

I do agree with you on that.

Thanks.

[optimus]

What you learned in your little "class" is bullshit. There are all kinds of studies that PROVE that marijuana is not addictive, physically or psychologically. Caffeine is a thousand times more addictive than marijuana.

[kellyb]

Physically it may not be that addictive, at least compared to other drugs. But psychologically it is, even if users don't want to admit that.

It's less psychologically addictive than caffeine. Sure. there's an element of psychological addiction (I was a total extreme pothead from ages 18-20) but a very minimal amount of resolution is necessary to stop smoking pot.

I stopped smoking pot, after years of smoking pot daily, about 15 years ago. I did it as an experiment. I totally expected to go back to pot smoking fairly quickly, but instead decided that pot really wasn't for me. Not because pot is "bad", but because I discovered that being high on pot all the time is basically just like not being high all the time, for me. I didn't get smarter, etc once I stopped getting high. I also didn't become emotionally different. As Carlin said, "It eventually suggests its own disuse."

I think there are evil drugs - crack, coke, heroin, alcohol, meth, tobacco, etc that NEVER suggest their own disuse. Or, if they do, they do it in a powerless way.

Then there are relatively innocent drugs that are overall useful - MDMA, pot, LSD, caffeine - and some of them are definitely helpful overall for most people...and when they cease to be useful, the user can clearly see it. And stopping use is not very hard. "Psychological addiction" is only a real threat when it's coupled with "biological addiction", I suspect.

[lily]

It's less psychologically addictive than caffeine. Sure. there's an element of psychological addiction (I was a total extreme pothead from ages 18-20) but a very minimal amount of resolution is necessary to stop smoking pot.

I stopped smoking pot, after years of smoking pot daily, about 15 years ago. I did it as an experiment. I totally expected to go back to pot smoking fairly quickly, but instead decided that pot really wasn't for me. Not because pot is "bad", but because I discovered that being high on pot all the time is basically just like not being high all the time, for me. I didn't get smarter, etc once I stopped getting high. I also didn't become emotionally different. As Carlin said, "It eventually suggests its own disuse."

I think there are evil drugs - crack, coke, heroin, alcohol, meth, tobacco, etc that NEVER suggest their own disuse. Or, if they do, they do it in a powerless way.

Then there are relatively innocent drugs that are overall useful - MDMA, pot, LSD, caffeine - and some of them are definitely helpful overall for most people...and when they cease to be useful, the user can clearly see it. An stopping use is not very hard. "Psychological addiction" is only a real threat when it's coupled with "biological addiction", I suspect.

I agree with your point that there are much worse drugs, like the ones you mentioned (meth, coke, heroin, etc). But I totally disagree with just about everything else you said. The reality is, just about anything can be addictive, including marijuana. And I'm not just talking about narcotics, people use all sorts of things to escape, or to feel good, like food, sex, work, video games, etc. There are many things that may not be physically harmful (unless abused) but when used as a crutch or a way to run from inner pain, it becomes unhealthy, in more ways than one.

And btw, I know we are off topic now, but I'm glad you shared that you were a pothead for those years. Now your story about going from belief to atheism makes much more sense.

[kellyb]

I love how you say that as if you're some sort of an expert. Nope, marijuana is not psychologically addictive. I haven't smoked it in about 4 years. No cravings either.

Oh, I'd say there's some small amount of psychological addiction that happens to some people. I was psychologically addicted for a while. But it's a really easy-to-kick addiction. A few days of mild cravings and you're on to other things.

Of course, that sort of "addiction" might not be what lily meant. I was, 15 years ago, "addicted" to pot like I'm addicted to the internet now. And every couple of months, my internet gets cut off, and like when I stopped smoking pot, I get annoyed for a day or 2. And like then, I just adapt. No HOLY SHIT MUST DO ANYTHING TO GET IT impulses. I just tend to want a good book to read to compensate. That's it.

[kellyb]

I agree with your point that there are much worse drugs, like the ones you mentioned (meth, coke, heroin, etc). But I totally disagree with just about everything else you said. The reality is, just about anything can be addictive, including marijuana. And I'm not just talking about narcotics, people use all sorts of things to escape, or to feel good, like food, sex, work, video games, etc. There are many things that may not be physically harmful (unless abused) but when used as a crutch or a way to run from inner pain, it becomes unhealthy, in more ways than one.

And btw, I know we are off topic now, but I'm glad you shared that you were a pothead for those years. Now your story about going from belief to atheism makes much more sense.

Religion is the ULTIMATE crutch. The escapism of religion is probably the most addictive of all non heroin-esque substances, IMO.

[lily]

Religion is the ULTIMATE crutch. The escapism of religion is probably the most addictive of all non heroin-esque substances, IMO.

Not in the same way, but since you're an atheist, you wouldn't understand or believe it, if I tried to explain it to you.

I will just say this - If you're going to lean on something, it's infinitely better to lean on the source of life, truth, wisdom, goodness and love... than on an artificial high that kills brain cells and can put you on a path that leads to the other direction.

[big steve]

What's your excuse for believing the GOP's?

Believing their what? Try to make sense please.

[kellyb]

I never did any of the Really Addictive Drugs. Never did coke (well, except once, while drunk, to be honest...but it was really only once and it ended miserably) absolutely never did meth, never heroin. etc.

I did a lot of non-addictive drugs like acid and MDMA, tho.

But the most addictive, mind-warping thing I ever, ever got into was religion. I was raised in religion, then took a break, and then got back into religion (Born Again!) Religion was far more mind-bending than even acid.

[big steve]

You are a first class imbecile.

Since "first class" usually denotes the best, then you must be a "fourth class imbecile!"

[kellyb]

Not in the same way, but since you're an atheist, you wouldn't understand or believe it, if I tried to explain it to you.

I will just say this - If you're going to lean on something, it's infinitely better to lean on the source of life, truth, wisdom, goodness and love... than on an artificial high that kills brain cells and can put you on a path that leads to the other direction.

If I'm going to lean on "the source of life, truth, wisdom, goodness and love" I have to lean on fellow, flawed humans. Because I know your "god" and know he/she/it almost definitely does not exist outside of our imaginations.

Like I mentioned, I haven't smoked pot for 15 years. I'm not into any other drugs any more, either. Not even religion/cultism.

[lily]

I never did any of the Really Addictive Drugs. Never did coke (well, except once, while drunk, to be honest...but it was really only once and it ended miserably) absolutely never did meth, never heroin. etc.

I did a lot of non-addictive drugs like acid and MDMA, tho.

But the most addictive, mind-warping thing I ever, ever got into was religion. I was raised in religion, then took a break, and then got back into religion (Born Again!) Religion was far more mind-bending than even acid.

"Going back to religion" is not the same thing as being "born again." A person can go to church for years and never go through spiritual regeneration, stop going to church for a while, then go back, and still be unregenerate. And there are other people who never set foot in a church, but DO become regenerated and their life changes from that point on, and it had nothing to do with "religion."

There is a huge and very important difference between "religion" and God. God=life. So, to compare God to a destructive addiction that leads to death just proves to me what I already suspected, that your negative experience was with religion, and religion alone.

[lily]

If I'm going to lean on "the source of life, truth, wisdom, goodness and love" I have to lean on fellow, flawed humans. Because I know your "god" and know he/she/it almost definitely does not exist outside of our imaginations.

Like I mentioned, I haven't smoked pot for 15 years. I'm not into any other drugs any more, either. Not even religion/cultism.

Kelly, with all due respect, you know full well that flawed humans are not the source of life, truth, wisdom, beauty, goodness and love itself.

But anyway, we're way off topic here.

[Cyclone Ranger]

Religion is the ULTIMATE crutch. The escapism of religion is probably the most addictive of all non heroin-esque substances, IMO.

Only if you consider a meaningful universe a crutch.

[Malcolm Wright]

I agree with your point that there are much worse drugs, like the ones you mentioned (meth, coke, heroin, etc). But I totally disagree with just about everything else you said. The reality is, just about anything can be addictive, including marijuana. And I'm not just talking about narcotics, people use all sorts of things to escape, or to feel good, like food, sex, work, video games, etc. There are many things that may not be physically harmful (unless abused) but when used as a crutch or a way to run from inner pain, it becomes unhealthy, in more ways than one.

Of course anything can be addictive - it depends on the person, how prone to addiction their personality is... But for the intent of this discussion, we're looking at the legality of a substance based on its addictiveness. Yes?
Nicotine and caffeine are both more addictive than marijuana. Both are legal. Nicotine is taxed by government.

And btw, I know we are off topic now, but I'm glad you shared that you were a pothead for those years. Now your story about going from belief to atheism makes much more sense.

In what way does it make sense? You think that pot somehow makes people into atheists? Care to provide some sort of evidence of this?

M

[Malcolm Wright]

To be fair, everyone resorts to crutches in some form or another. Any habit, any form of material shelter or beneficial human relationship, any form of intellectual or spiritual reference from which the individual draws strength and protection, can be considered a crutch.

Some people who smoke pot are self-medicating. This can be a good thing, until it ceases to be. Meaning that for a while that form of medication may be desirable considering the alternatives, but at some stage the individual should seek to move to a place where he or she can cope without it, if we are working from the operative assumption that one should do without as many crutches as one can.

M.

[lily]

Of course anything can be addictive - it depends on the person, how prone to addiction their personality is... But for the intent of this discussion, we're looking at the legality of a substance based on its addictiveness. Yes?
Nicotine and caffeine are both more addictive than marijuana. Both are legal. Nicotine is taxed by government.

No, we weren't talking about legality at all. We were just talking about whether or not marijuana is addictive. Then the discussion took another turn, when kelly brought up religion.

In what way does it make sense? You think that pot somehow makes people into atheists? Care to provide some sort of evidence of this?

M

What I have seen with my own eyes, and what the scriptures teach is that certain things separate people from God. It's definitely not limited to marijuana, or other drugs. I'm sure this will be completely unpopular (hey, what else is new) but getting high on a habitual basis is a sin, and sin separates people from God. And that's not the end of it... There's actually more to be said about this, but for now I'll leave it at that.