I don't know exactly when Men discovered that there used to be bigass dinosaurs at some point, but I'm curious how the bible (or religion in general) deals with this.

I find it hard to even understand how people can actively and sincerely believe in a religion when there's so many inconsistencies.

So how DOES the bible or koran or whatever deal with Dino's?

As far as I know, the religious folk stick to: God created everything at the same time, so man must have been around with the dinosaurs. Don't know about any other religious texts besides the bible. That is an explanation I've heard anyway.

I'm no biblical scholar, but, I don't ever recall any teaching of dinosaurs in Sunday School or VBS. Don't even think the Bible mentions them. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong...

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Uh, what country is this??

The Bible said that God called forth for the Earth and Seas to spring forth life. What's the big deal?

The whole thing can be debated on grammar points more than doctrine (regarding Biblical creation). Honestly, the Bible doesn't contradict evolution at all. It's just that some people interpret the words to mean one thing and others another. Eh, it's a minor discussion that some people like to turn into a major defining point in religion.

HOW God made the world is inconsequential . . . but great discussion. That's about it.

The impression that I got was that some creationists say that the 'God created the earth in 7 days' bit is figurative - that it was actually a period of millions of years, where the dinosaurs would've been created on an earlier 'day' than the humans. I guess the impression that I got was that God just had a different idea of timing, or something.

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"I have no regrets. Regret only makes wrinkles." - Sophia Loren

Originally posted by Aphasia:
The impression that I got was that some creationists say that the 'God created the earth in 7 days' bit is figurative - that it was actually a period of millions of years, where the dinosaurs would've been created on an earlier 'day' than the humans. I guess the impression that I got was that God just had a different idea of timing, or something.



I guess I can feel that.

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"Discrimination is a hellhound that gnaws at Negroes in every waking moment of their lives to remind them that the lie of their inferiority is accepted as truth in the society dominating them"
Martin Luther King Jr.
"You cannot separate peace from freedom, because no one can be at peace unless he has his freedom" -Malcom X

We had an evolution thread going over at SN a few months back.

And someone quoted a passage in the bible that spoke of large gargantuan creatures, etc etc. But that is kind of irelevant because if dino bones were discovered before the bible was 'written' then it could all just be a history/story book.

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Manu Narayan

Well considering the bible was written by a bunch of relatively ignorant (atleaset compared to todays standards)and disparate dudes over the course of years and years you could hardly expect it to contain any challenges to biology, since they knew nothing about it...

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"He could not plead want of employment, nor incapacity of getting his bread in an honest way, but frankly own'd it was to get rid of the disagreeable superiority of some masters he was acquainted with and the love of novelty and change."

William Defoe on Bartholomew Roberts career of piracy

Doinosaurs vs the Bible

I don't recall any mention of Doinosaurs, true.

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-Curt

"There ought to be limits to Freedom."

http://home.earthlink.net/~fiveofanatic/exmo.jpg

Curt you're a smartass.

My problem with the figurative interpretation of the Bible is that some thigns are taken at face value as FACT whereas others are taken as metaphor...

Also, moving this to 'Big Debates'

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Manu Narayan

IF you take a looksy at the play "Inherit the Wind" (Or go rent the movie with Spencer Tracey)... it revolves around the "Bates Monkey Trials" where a teacher got fired for teaching evolution over the bible...

Well Drummonds trump card he plays to "win the argument" is that...

How many hours are in gods day? 23? 24? 25?
A million years?

Could be...

Basically what Aph said...

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Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
George Carlin

Originally posted by DaOgre:
IF you take a looksy at the play "Inherit the Wind" (Or go rent the movie with Spencer Tracey)... it revolves around the "Bates Monkey Trials" where a teacher got fired for teaching evolution over the bible...

Well Drummonds trump card he plays to "win the argument" is that...

How many hours are in gods day? 23? 24? 25?
A million years?

Could be...

Basically what Aph said...



Inherit the Wind was an incredibly cheesy movie. I wish they had just made it on the Scopes Monkey Trial, rather than a parody of it. I think that would've been a lot more interesting.

-Patrick

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aka, Grand Master Wheat Thin
"The difference between an individual terrorist and a government in some cases may be simply that the former has a bomb but doesn't have an air force."
-William Blum

Actually it was based exactly on the Scopes Monkey Trials... they just changed the name... were you paying attention during that movie or making out with your girlfriend?

It followed the same arguments and such that were posed in the Scopes trial...

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Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
George Carlin

Originally posted by DaOgre:
Actually it was based exactly on the Scopes Monkey Trials... they just changed the name... were you paying attention during that movie or making out with your girlfriend?

It followed the same arguments and such that were posed in the Scopes trial...



Actually, I saw it in college, in class. You know, that place where you dropped out of... And yes, it followed the arguments, but it didn't follow the court documents exactly, that's what I mean when it could've been more interesting.

-Patrick


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aka, Grand Master Wheat Thin
"The difference between an individual terrorist and a government in some cases may be simply that the former has a bomb but doesn't have an air force."
-William Blum

Originally posted by PatTheAnarChrist:
Actually, I saw it in college, in class. You know, that place where you dropped out of... And yes, it followed the arguments, but it didn't follow the court documents exactly, that's what I mean when it could've been more interesting.

-Patrick




Claws in cat... sorry you have some animosity towards the choices I chose to make in life? guess what? I dont

Your right... every movie ever made should stick exactly to the historical events right? Otherwise whats the point in making the movie...

Thats why I hated the movie Gettysburg... the people didnt say the EXACT same words that they really said at Gettysburg...

Dont you hate that?

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Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part to us, do they?
George Carlin

Well, according to some christians, the world is only a few thousand years old. I would not try to ask them for too many facts about dinosaurs.

Does the Bible mention dinosaurs? What does the Bible say about dinosaurs and man?

Evolutionists claim that dinosaurs evolved over millions of years. They imagine that one kind of animal slowly changed over long periods of time to become a different kind of animal. For instance, they believe that amphibians changed into reptiles (including dinosaurs) by this gradual process. This would mean, of course, that there would have to have been millions of creatures during that time that would be "in between," as amphibians evolved into reptiles. Evidence of these "transitional forms," as they are called, should be abundant. However, many fossil experts admit that not one unquestionable transitional form between any group of creatures and another has been found anywhere. If dinosaurs evolved from amphibians, there should be, for example, fossil evidence of animals that are part dinosaur and part something else. However, there is no proof of this anywhere. In fact, if you go into any museum you will see fossils of dinosaurs that are 100% dinosaur, not something in between. There are no 25%, 50%, 75%, or even 99% dinosaurs-they are all 100% dinosaur!

The Bible tells us that God created all of the land animals on the sixth day of creation. As dinosaurs were land animals, they must have been made on this day, alongside Adam and Eve, who were also created on Day Six (Genesis 1:24-31). If God designed and created dinosaurs, they would have been fully functional, designed to do what they were created for, and would have been 100% dinosaur. This fits exactly with the evidence from the fossil record.

Evolutionists declare that no man ever lived alongside dinosaurs. The Bible, however, makes it plain that dinosaurs and people must have lived together.

The Bible teaches (in Genesis 1:29-30) that the original animals (and the first humans) were commanded to be vegetarian. There were no meat eaters in the original creation. Furthermore, there was no death. It was an unblemished world, with Adam and Eve and animals (including dinosaurs) living in perfect harmony, eating only plants.

Sadly, it did not stay this way for very long. Adam rebelled against his Creator, bringing sin into the world (Genesis 3:1-7; Romans 5:12). Because of this rebellion, Adam, and thus all of his descendants (you and me), gave up the right to live with a Holy (sinless) and just God. God therefore judged sin with death.

The Bible plainly teaches from Genesis to Revelation that there was no death of animals or humans before Adam sinned. (Consider just a few of the many passages, such as: Romans 5:12; Genesis 2:17; Genesis 1:2930; Romans 8:20-22; Acts 3:21; Hebrews 9:22; I Corinthians 15; Revelation 21:1-4; Revelation 22:3.) This means there could not have been any animal fossils (and no dinosaur bones) before sin.

After Adam's sin, animals and people started to die. It was now a different world, one of death and strife. A world that was once beautiful now suffered under the curse placed upon it by the Creator (Genesis 3:14-19).

In Genesis chapter six, we read that all flesh (man and animals) had "corrupted his way upon the Earth" (Genesis 6:12). Perhaps people and animals were killing each other; maybe dinosaurs had started killing other animals and humans. In any case, the Bible describes the world as "wicked."

Because of this wickedness, God warned a godly man named Noah that He was going to destroy the world with a Flood (Genesis 6:13). God therefore commanded him to build a great ship (the Ark) so that all the kinds of land animals (which must have included dinosaurs) and Noah's family could survive on board while the Flood destroyed the entire Earth (Genesis 6:14-20).

Some people think that dinosaurs were too big, or there were too many of them, to go on this Ark. However, there were not very many different kinds of dinosaurs. There are certainly hundreds of dinosaur names, but many of these were given to just a bit of bone or skeletons of the same dinosaur found in other countries. It is also reasonable to assume that different sizes, varieties, and sexes of the same kind of dinosaur have ended up with different names. For example, look at the many different varieties and sizes of dogs, but they are all the same kind-the dog kind! In reality, there may have been fewer than 50 kinds of dinosaurs.

God sent two of every (seven of some) land animal into the Ark (Genesis 7:2-3; 7:8-9)-there were no exceptions. Therefore, dinosaurs must have been on the Ark. Even though there was ample room in the huge ship for large animals, perhaps God sent young adults into the Ark that still had plenty of room for them to grow.

Well, what happened to all the land animals that did not go on the Ark? Very simply, they drowned. Many would have been covered with tons of mud as the rampaging water covered the land (Genesis 7:11-12,19). Because of this quick burial, many of the animals would have been preserved as fossils. If this happened, you would expect to find evidence of billions of dead things buried in rock layers (formed from this mud) all over the Earth. This is exactly what you do find.

By the way, the Flood of Noah's day probably occurred just over 4,500 years ago. Creationists believe that this event formed many of the fossil layers around the Earth. (Additional fossil layers were formed by other floods as the Earth settled down after the great Flood.) Thus, the dinosaur fossils which were formed as a result of this Flood were probably formed about 4,500 years ago, not millions of years ago.

If the different kinds of dinosaurs survived the Flood, then they must have come off the Ark and lived in the post-Flood world.

In the Bible, in the book of Job, chapter 40, verses 15-24, God describes to Job (who lived after the Flood) a great beast with which Job was familiar. This great animal, called "behemoth," is described as "the chief of the ways of God," perhaps the biggest land animal God had created. Impressively, he moved his tail like a cedar tree! Although some Bible commentaries say this may have been an elephant or hippopotamus, the description actually fits that of a dinosaur like Brachiosaurus. Elephants and hippos certainly do not have tails like cedar trees!!

Actually, very few animals are singled out in the Bible for such a detailed description. Contrary to what many may think, what we know now as dinosaurs get more mention in the Scriptures than most animals! So dinosaurs-all the different kinds-must have lived alongside of people after the Flood.

Sigh, there to begin...

Evolutionists claim that dinosaurs evolved over millions of years. They imagine that one kind of animal slowly changed over long periods of time to become a different kind of animal. For instance, they believe that amphibians changed into reptiles (including dinosaurs) by this gradual process. This would mean, of course, that there would have to have been millions of creatures during that time that would be "in between," as amphibians evolved into reptiles. Evidence of these "transitional forms," as they are called, should be abundant. However, many fossil experts admit that not one unquestionable transitional form between any group of creatures and another has been found anywhere. If dinosaurs evolved from amphibians, there should be, for example, fossil evidence of animals that are part dinosaur and part something else. However, there is no proof of this anywhere. In fact, if you go into any museum you will see fossils of dinosaurs that are 100% dinosaur, not something in between. There are no 25%, 50%, 75%, or even 99% dinosaurs-they are all 100% dinosaur![quote]

There are MAY so called 'missing' links. You forget also that a lot of the changes in animals are not just shown in the skeleton, but shown in the biological aspects (of which time does not allow us to see.) There are many half bird/half dinosaurs. There are many snakes found with legs. Even modern day snakes had 'marks' where appendages USED to be.

[quote]The Bible tells us that God created all of the land animals on the sixth day of creation. As dinosaurs were land animals, they must have been made on this day, alongside Adam and Eve, who were also created on Day Six (Genesis 1:24-31). If God designed and created dinosaurs, they would have been fully functional, designed to do what they were created for, and would have been 100% dinosaur. This fits exactly with the evidence from the fossil record.

How? I will explain more in the next segment.

Evolutionists declare that no man ever lived alongside dinosaurs. The Bible, however, makes it plain that dinosaurs and people must have lived together.

The Bible teaches (in Genesis 1:29-30) that the original animals (and the first humans) were commanded to be vegetarian. There were no meat eaters in the original creation. Furthermore, there was no death. It was an unblemished world, with Adam and Eve and animals (including dinosaurs) living in perfect harmony, eating only plants.

You stated the fossil record earlier, where are the human/dinos found along side one another?


After Adam's sin, animals and people started to die. It was now a different world, one of death and strife. A world that was once beautiful now suffered under the curse placed upon it by the Creator (Genesis 3:14-19).

In Genesis chapter six, we read that all flesh (man and animals) had "corrupted his way upon the Earth" (Genesis 6:12). Perhaps people and animals were killing each other; maybe dinosaurs had started killing other animals and humans. In any case, the Bible describes the world as "wicked."

Because of this wickedness, God warned a godly man named Noah that He was going to destroy the world with a Flood (Genesis 6:13). God therefore commanded him to build a great ship (the Ark) so that all the kinds of land animals (which must have included dinosaurs) and Noah's family could survive on board while the Flood destroyed the entire Earth (Genesis 6:14-20).

Some people think that dinosaurs were too big, or there were too many of them, to go on this Ark. However, there were not very many different kinds of dinosaurs. There are certainly hundreds of dinosaur names, but many of these were given to just a bit of bone or skeletons of the same dinosaur found in other countries. It is also reasonable to assume that different sizes, varieties, and sexes of the same kind of dinosaur have ended up with different names. For example, look at the many different varieties and sizes of dogs, but they are all the same kind-the dog kind! In reality, there may have been fewer than 50 kinds of dinosaurs.

God sent two of every (seven of some) land animal into the Ark (Genesis 7:2-3; 7:8-9)-there were no exceptions. Therefore, dinosaurs must have been on the Ark. Even though there was ample room in the huge ship for large animals, perhaps God sent young adults into the Ark that still had plenty of room for them to grow.

Well, what happened to all the land animals that did not go on the Ark? Very simply, they drowned. Many would have been covered with tons of mud as the rampaging water covered the land (Genesis 7:11-12,19). Because of this quick burial, many of the animals would have been preserved as fossils. If this happened, you would expect to find evidence of billions of dead things buried in rock layers (formed from this mud) all over the Earth. This is exactly what you do find.

By the way, the Flood of Noah's day probably occurred just over 4,500 years ago. Creationists believe that this event formed many of the fossil layers around the Earth. (Additional fossil layers were formed by other floods as the Earth settled down after the great Flood.) Thus, the dinosaur fossils which were formed as a result of this Flood were probably formed about 4,500 years ago, not millions of years ago.

Where is this recorded mass extinction in the ofssil record from then? What abotu the distinctly different time periods of mass extinction? What about the fact that 6500 years ago the Hindus were in the Indus Valley? And the Hindus are around today...The human record predates what you propose for the fossil record...

If the different kinds of dinosaurs survived the Flood, then they must have come off the Ark and lived in the post-Flood world.

In the Bible, in the book of Job, chapter 40, verses 15-24, God describes to Job (who lived after the Flood) a great beast with which Job was familiar. This great animal, called "behemoth," is described as "the chief of the ways of God," perhaps the biggest land animal God had created. Impressively, he moved his tail like a cedar tree! Although some Bible commentaries say this may have been an elephant or hippopotamus, the description actually fits that of a dinosaur like Brachiosaurus. Elephants and hippos certainly do not have tails like cedar trees!!

I am going to have to look that up, because I believe there are verses before and after teh behemoth that kind of invalidate it as being a dinosaur.

Actually, very few animals are singled out in the Bible for such a detailed description. Contrary to what many may think, what we know now as dinosaurs get more mention in the Scriptures than most animals! So dinosaurs-all the different kinds-must have lived alongside of people after the Flood. The ability to draw conclusions from no fact astounds me.

This lies on one HUGE fact. The bible being 100% literal. You are taking the bible as a historiacal piece. If it was documented and that was shown to be true, I then MAY believe some of this...


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Manu Narayan

Well yea you cant argue against the bible within its own framework. I gave up trying to, theres so many interpertations. You cant argue against constant fluctuations and flip flopping interpretations unless you simply reject it as a whole. Sure its a nice piece of literature and its worth studying for the impact it has had and some of its historical documentation, but seriously people who believe that its the word of god or that its a divine blue print for life, HA! What a joke. Wake up. It was all written by people just like you and me. I have as much repect for bible thumpers as I do for people who worship William L. Hubbard and thats basically zero. But hey if thats the way they choose to live fine, just dont start intruding on my life, theres no room for god and jesus in my conscience, its not that i rejected them its just that i have never found any reason to believe in them in the first place.

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"He could not plead want of employment, nor incapacity of getting his bread in an honest way, but frankly own'd it was to get rid of the disagreeable superiority of some masters he was acquainted with and the love of novelty and change."

William Defoe on Bartholomew Roberts career of piracy

[This message has been edited by CodyChaos (edited 07-06-2001).]

Hah, I would quote a Corporate Avenger Song right now...but I think I woudl get lynched...



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Manu Narayan