How come that today, Iraq has become a place where women cannot show themselves without their medieval garments or drive a car without being shot by some militia... Looks like post Saddam Iraq isnt that liberated after all.

You are right.

You both watch too much TV.

You both watch too much TV.

Maybe you don't watch enough.:p

Seriously,are you saying this post is incorrect?

Freedom is on the March!

Let me modify that statement a bit... "freedom is on Mars"... Why dont you go there, Boo, and liberate more desert :D
So, I dont know what improvement there might be for women of Iraq, Afghanistan, Kosowa... I mean, that crusade was partly motivated by our sense of fashion, and yet, there they go, dressed like medieval nuns...
Cmon, guys, you must drop more bombs over there :\ bomb them back to Bikini stage, bomb them to Waikiki-beach-stoneage or to paradise lost - anything but this...

Token left wing anti war thread but I'll bite.

What would you have us do Red Shine 'y?

Let me modify that statement a bit... "freedom is on Mars"... Why dont you go there, Boo, and liberate more desert :D
So, I dont know what improvement there might be for women of Iraq, Afghanistan, Kosowa... I mean, that crusade was partly motivated by our sense of fashion, and yet, there they go, dressed like medieval nuns...
Cmon, guys, you must drop more bombs over there :\ bomb them back to Bikini stage, bomb them to Waikiki-beach-stoneage or to paradise lost - anything but this...


yes... we have some mighty big bombs... ... obliterate the u.s. ... in that fashion.. what do you get... something hard to chew on.... (we're still the police force of the world) ... and trying to make the world a better place to live in.. and we're gonna look at ourselves too... no choice - but to move forward... with or without (military/nasa lives outside the borders of our catastrophe)

go live on mars... good point... lets see if we can instantiate life there ? (it'd mainly be a bunch of mold... that ate their dust).... humans can't live there less we put a moon up and .. find the water... or figure out a way to change some of their stuff to water... water is imporant... even in small degrees...)

M-theory... - the best thing i ever heard was we ended up creating technology without having the base line proof that it'd work... that it exists...
but it worked anyway... (some people in the future will still be at odds)... as if we can compete beyond with what tools we have to work with...

but to touch back on ... how we're affecting those that are in direct blast radius of us trying to help them.... (those nuns)... well... shit... thley're good good people... but the world is changing... how fast... do you think they can catch up?

What would you have us do Red Shine 'y?That isn't the point Dude. Just like all the leftists that post here, it is not about freedom or liberation, it is about antiwar, anti-Bush, anti-Us....they offer no solutions only criticisms. I suppose some believe life under Hussein was preferable

What would you have us do Red Shine 'y?
I get the funny feeling that this question will go unanswered.

That isn't the point Dude. Just like all the leftists that post here, it is not about freedom or liberation, it is about antiwar, anti-Bush, anti-Us....they offer no solutions only criticisms. I suppose some believe life under Hussein was preferable


life under Hussein... they're slowly starting to realize that they don't like themselves blowing themselves up... well eventually... we have a flower that blossoms in the Middle east... ME personally i could give a rats ass less.. wasn't thinking that far ahead... i was too young when all this was happening to think this way... but i was documenting... and ... all i can say.. is this change is gonna be fore tha betta... yumm... natural selection is a bitch.. and that's kinda what they're dealing with... but that's nature...

don't give up hope... they might see a better freedom than we do... in our lifetime... *pinch me... i'm not dreaming

How come that today, Iraq has become a place where women cannot show themselves without their medieval garments...Are not Iraq's laws made by a democratically elected government? If yes, then the people must want those impositions upon themselves. If women don't like it, they can go to court, I guess. That's better than the situation under Saddam. Saddam's word was law and there was no recourse.

they offer no solutions only criticisms.

Oh no not criticisms! What amoral fiends.

And fix your own mess.

Oh no not criticisms! What amoral fiends.

And fix your own mess.It wasn't "our" mess, it was the world's mess in general and Iraq's mess specifically...."Fix it" is just what we are doing...sitting on the side, barking, pissing 'n moaning, whinning, complaining, and criticizing is what the left has done

What Iraq becomes will not sit well with those hoping for "freedom and democracy" western style. All BA wants now is a country that sends us it's oil: fights jihadi groups: doesn't wage war with neighbors: Doesn't cosy up...too much...with Iran. If we get Egyptian type democracy we're lucky. If we get Ahmadinejad type....What we won't get is a beacon in the Middle East!

yes... ... they're good good people... but the world is changing... how fast... do you think they can catch up?
Those "good people" have right to live in a world of their making. Thats what I call democracy. Those "stubborn insurgents" had a different point of view and there might be millions of differences to get finicky about, but those whove got those tanks rolling would do the same to any people, crushing any resistance opposing their point of view.
And what is their point of view? They love black. They would send any of them poor middle-west boys into oblivion to bring more black, oily matter to their markets. They dont mind scorching the soil black with their grenades in the process. They dont care if they produce waist - widows, distroyes families, all dressed in black - because black is the color of capitalism!

What Iraq becomes will not sit well with those hoping for "freedom and democracy" western style. All BA wants now is a country that sends us it's oil: fights jihadi groups: doesn't wage war with neighbors: Doesn't cosy up...too much...with Iran. If we get Egyptian type democracy we're lucky. If we get Ahmadinejad type....What we won't get is a beacon in the Middle East!
Right now youve got "do-as-told-democracy" colliding with "over-my-dead-body-democracy". Some democracy, indeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 86Dude
What would you have us do Red Shine 'y?
I get the funny feeling that this question will go unanswered.
No use for gloomy mood here, Betty, you funny guy :) < earnest smile
You just make sure that Gucci, Versace, Klein, Dior and other houses establish filials in Baghdad. Lets bring civilisation to Babylon :rolleyes:

How come that today, Iraq has become a place where women cannot show themselves without their medieval garments or drive a car without being shot by some militia... Looks like post Saddam Iraq isnt that liberated after all.
So women don't have rights, society has regressed into the middle ages etc etc.... sounds like the plan Bush has for the United States.:hmm:

We're expected to dictate women's fashion there? Like beer-belly jeans and tramp stamps are preferable to their traditional garb?

Hell if the AFA had it's way women would wear veils here too.

Right now youve got "do-as-told-democracy" colliding with "over-my-dead-body-democracy". Some democracy, indeed.
A grotesque distortion of reality

It wasn't "our" mess, it was the world's mess in general and Iraq's mess specifically...."Fix it" is just what we are doing...sitting on the side, barking, pissing 'n moaning, whinning, complaining, and criticizing is what the left has done
All I see is a minority of worlds richest countries using self-created fata-morgana to rearrange the world. Do you mean that your presence in Iraq is dictated by "peoples will"? That tune you play over and over again sounds pretty false :D

Are not Iraq's laws made by a democratically elected government? If yes, then the people must want those impositions upon themselves. If women don't like it, they can go to court, I guess. That's better than the situation under Saddam. Saddam's word was law and there was no recourse.
Saddam-society was a fascistoid patriarchal society where women received protection from their husbands. Saddam oppressed religious fundamentalists and favoured military structures. He promoted western-style life... hell, if only you gave that guy a single thought, you would find him quite sympathetic :D

Saddam-society was a fascistoid patriarchal society where women received protection from their husbands. Saddam oppressed religious fundamentalists and favoured military structures. He promoted western-style life... hell, if only you gave that guy a single thought, you would find him quite sympathetic :D

dont tell them-their inconsistency could prove to be their salvation

All I see is a minority of worlds richest countries using self-created fata-morgana to rearrange the world. This is an example of how leftists view the world....with selected facts and by ignoring others.
Western Europe:
United Kingdom
Spain
Portugal
Denmark
Netherlands
IcelandItaly

Baltic States:
Estonia #
Latvia #
Lithuania #

Central Europe:
Poland
Czech Republic
Slovakia #
Hungary

Balkans:
Albania #
Macedonia #
Romania #
Bulgaria #
Turkey
Croatia #
Slovenia #

Eastern Europe
Ukraine

Japan
South Korea
Singapore
Philippines
Afghanistan
Azerbaijan
Uzbekistan
Georgia
Marshall Islands
Micronesia
Solomon Islands
Mongolia
Palau
Tonga

North America:
United States of America

South and Central America:
El Salvador
Colombia
Nicaragua
Costa Rica
Dominican Republic
Honduras

ANZ:
Australia

Middle East:
Kuwait

Africa:
Eritrea
Ethiopia
Uganda
Rwanda
Angola

That's a list of the coalition of the willing...yes it has some rich countries but many more are far from it. If you notice, there are also many "rich" countries not on it. Try a new line of rhetoric
Do you mean that your presence in Iraq is dictated by "peoples will"? That tune you play over and over again sounds pretty false :DDepends on which people you listen to. Those that were being oppressed or those that profitted from the oppressors

Saddam-society was a fascistoid patriarchal society where women received protection from their husbands. Saddam oppressed religious fundamentalists and favoured military structures. He promoted western-style life... hell, if only you gave that guy a single thought, you would find him quite sympathetic :DYup, Iraq was a regular ol' kite flying paradise

You know,Caddis,he isnt saying it was good-he's just saying we're all so twisted we should like Sadaam...

Then I have to go back to my first post where I said he offers no solutions only criticisms of the US. He should get off the fence and make a stand one way or the other, because he is saying America is twisted, Sadaam was bad, and yet removing him was not something the people wanted. Sounds rather chicken-shit if you ask me

Then I have to go back to my first post where I said he offers no solutions only criticisms of the US. He should get off the fence and make a stand one way or the other, because he is saying America is twisted, Sadaam was bad, and yet removing him was not something the people wanted. Sounds rather chicken-shit if you ask me
Sure, Caddis, theres never too late to go back :D and reevaluate things. Otherwise, you will find yourself saying about life "It taste like... chicken"!

Sure, Caddis, theres never too late to go back :D and reevaluate things.
I hope the result is not cut and run. We did that after WWI, in North Korea, in Indo-china, in 80's of Afganistan, the result of that stratege is the death of millions of people.

Then I have to go back to my first post where I said he offers no solutions only criticisms of the US. He should get off the fence and make a stand one way or the other, because he is saying America is twisted, Sadaam was bad, and yet removing him was not something the people wanted. Sounds rather chicken-shit if you ask me

I criticise the official story because it is obviously bullshit and knowing the real motives for being there would be good.

I hope the result is not cut and run. We did that after WWI, in North Korea, in Indo-china, in 80's of Afganistan, the result of that stratege is the death of millions of people.

I criticise the official story because it is obviously bullshit and knowing the real motives for being there would be good.
So true. I can see trough ornamented or incomplete "truth" and its good to know that most of you do it as well. Some facts cannot be refused but they can be concealed under tons of disinformation.

Our collective memory doesnt stretch out more than 2 months. We are unable to break through the wall of gibberish providing both questions and answers. Its a liers paradise! But no matter how many megaphones, there will always be some silence left, so - for a while or two - its time for independent thoughts! :)

:rolleyes:

Then I have to go back to my first post where I said he offers no solutions only criticisms of the US. He should get off the fence and make a stand one way or the other, because he is saying America is twisted, Sadaam was bad,and yet removing him was not something the people wanted. Sounds rather chicken-shit if you ask me

He didnt say the part in bold-he's saying Sadaam was our boy (and he was)-he wants us to leave but you''re right his reasoning leaves something to be desired but he IS a charmer!!!

He didnt say the part in bold-he's saying Sadaam was our boy (and he was)-he wants us to leave but you''re right his reasoning leaves something to be desired but he IS a charmer!!!
:hiya: well, hello there... *loads of carisma radiate...*

Thanks Mike for interpreting my words to the world. You have proved yourself worthy of carrying out my evangelium to the people. Let it be known as Evangely by St Mike ;)

How come that today, Iraq has become a place where women cannot show themselves without their medieval garments or drive a car without being shot by some militia... Looks like post Saddam Iraq isnt that liberated after all.

Calling those sheet-ghost robes "medieval" is insulting to middle ages everywhere.

Hell if the AFA had it's way women would wear veils here too.

Srsly.

Calling those sheet-ghost robes "medieval" is insulting to middle ages everywhere.

No it isnt.

:hiya: well, hello there... *loads of carisma radiate...*

Thanks Mike for interpreting my words to the world. You have proved yourself worthy of carrying out my evangelium to the people. Let it be known as Evangely by St Mike ;)

That's the strangest compliment I've recieved in a long time...