First the Pentagon sends them to war then they turn their backs on the psychiatrically wounded.

By Shankar Vedantam
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, May 11, 2006; Page A08

Nearly four in five service members returning from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan who were found to be at risk for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) were never referred by government clinicians for further help, according to a Government Accountability Office report due for release today.

The report says Defense Department officials were unable to explain why only some troops were referred for help. Many veterans groups have accused the government of playing down the risk of PTSD because of concerns over skyrocketing costs.

In all, 9,145 of 178,664 service members who took the screening test were found to be at risk. Of those at risk, 22 percent were referred for help. The Army and Air Force each referred 23 percent of those at risk, the Navy 18 percent and the Marines about 15 percent, according to a draft of the report obtained by The Washington Post.

"You would think that [referrals for treatment] would be the point of the whole screening tool," said Veterans Affairs spokesman Jim Benson. He said that the Defense Department was solely responsible for administering the screening test and making referral decisions.

"When 78 percent of the service members who are at risk of developing PTSD do not get a referral for further evaluation, then it's clear the assessment system is not working," he said in a statement. "Early assessment can prevent tragedy. Untreated PTSD can lead to substance abuse, severe depression and even suicide."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/10/AR2006051002195.html

this sounds like someone is trying to make controversy where none exists. exactly what is a "referral"? on active duty there are many outlets for help, and no referral is needed. does a referral mean they were ordered to see a shrink? were thay given the name of shrink? were they written out a fromal refferal to take to the shrink? were those not given a referral told to seek help but refused? like i said, this just sounds like someone trying to make a story out of nothing. of course, i could be wrong...

I call :bs: :bs: :bs: :bs:

We're constantly getting speeches about the PTSD asking us to come forward if we are having problems coping with what we saw. I've been to at least 5 meetings over the past year where they are asking troops to come forward for help and not just ignore it, and I haven't even been to Iraq. For someone to stand there and say the military is not taking care of it's own in this area is complete :bs: and they have no ****ing clue what they're talking about. We're constantly being offered help. We're offered help so much it's starting to get annoying. Thing is, they can't make troops with ptsd get help if they don't want it, but trust me, the help is there and everybody in a uniform is well aware of it.

If someone isn't treated, it is because they refused treatment. period. end of story. Shankar Vedantam is scewing the truth to make a story and should be ashamed of himself.

I call :bs: :bs: :bs: :bs:

We're constantly getting speeches about the PTSD asking us to come forward if we are having problems coping with what we saw. I've been to at least 5 meetings over the past year where they are asking troops to come forward for help and not just ignore it, and I haven't even been to Iraq. For someone to stand there and say the military is not taking care of it's own in this area is complete :bs: and they have no ****ing clue what they're talking about. We're constantly being offered help. We're offered help so much it's starting to get annoying. Thing is, they can't make troops with ptsd get help if they don't want it, but trust me, the help is there and everybody in a uniform is well aware of it.

If someone isn't treated, it is because they refused treatment. period. end of story. Shankar Vedantam is scewing the truth to make a story and should be ashamed of himself.
bah, what do you know? your not implying that a politician might be distorting the truth to further his agenda, are you? :eek3:

Politicians lying? Never! :eek:

^but, Betty, don't you find that there is a stigma attached to seeking psychiatric help for those in the military?

While the official policy might be to offer assistance, isn't it really about the underlying pervasive attitude that any show of weakness will be a detriment to your career?

My first husband was Air Force, and I know, from listening to him and the other guys talk about it, (this was Desert Storm), that no one wanted to have a psych report in their jacket.

Maybe things have changed, but if they haven't, I can't help but have the feeling that there are plenty of men and women who are not seeking the help they need in order to protect their careers.

^but, Betty, don't you find that there is a stigma attached to seeking psychiatric help for those in the military?

While the official policy might be to offer assistance, isn't it really about the underlying pervasive attitude that any show of weakness will be a detriment to your career?

My first husband was Air Force, and I know, from listening to him and the other guys talk about it, (this was Desert Storm), that no one wanted to have a psych report in their jacket.

Maybe things have changed, but if they haven't, I can't help but have the feeling that there are plenty of men and women who are not seeking the help they need in order to protect their careers.that's not what the article is saying though. that's why i was asking what the definition is of a referral. i agree that in my time there was a stigma associated with psychological treatment, but the article is saying that military is not really even offering treatment.

Well, Betty's claim is that he's getting plenty of offers for treatment, (and I guess I really should have asked this in an aside), I was wondering if the attitudes toward those who seek treatment has changed.

Wasn't really trying to drag this off topic.

We're constantly getting speeches about the PTSD asking us to come forward if we are having problems coping with what we saw. .....I've been to at least 5 meetings over the past year where they are asking troops to come forward for help and not just ignore it, and I haven't even been to Iraq. ....... .

If someone isn't treated, it is because they refused treatment. period. end of story. Shankar Vedantam is scewing the truth to make a story and should be ashamed of himself.

Thing is Betty, many times people with PTSD don't know they are suffering with it so your argument about being offered help and refusing it is kind of lame.

Vedantam maybe trying to make a story but I suspect the referral rate is not anywhere high enough. I don't have stats on hand to back up my suspicions but the Vietnam experience should be used to foster greater emphasis on PTSD screening/referrals.

Thing is Betty, many times people with PTSD don't know they are suffering with it so your argument about being offered help and refusing it is kind of lame.

Vedantam maybe trying to make a story but I suspect the referral rate is not anywhere high enough. I don't have stats on hand to back up my suspicions but the Vietnam experience should be used to foster greater emphasis on PTSD screening/referrals.again, what do they mean by a referral? and the vietnam experience has been learned from, and there is a much greater emphasis on ptsd than in previous years.

You guys aren't getting it. Nobody is getting in front of us and saying, "Anyone with PTSD please step forward". That's ricockulous. People are being told that if they have problems dealing with their experiences, they can get help, and they are specifically being told THAT IT WILL NOT AFFECT THEIR CARREERS AND THAT EVERYTHING IS CONFIDENTIAL. We expect some people to have it. There's no reason for it to affect their carreers.

Also anyone that is identified as suffering from PTSD is offered help directly under the exact same circumstances. Confidentiality.

The only way it would be an issue with their carreers is if they pose a threat to others, which is very rarely the case, additionally, on the rare occasion that someone is discharged under PTSD related circumstances, they are given full disability payments for life.

Like it or not, we can't MAKE people get treatment for that. It's the law. You can thank Barbra Boxer for that one.

Once again folks, please ask before you make statements concerning a subject you only know about through what the press is telling you. The press rarely presents the whole story, just enough to grab your attention and up their ratings.

You guys aren't getting it. Nobody is getting in front of us and saying, "Anyone with PTSD please step forward". That's ricockulous. People are being told that if they have problems dealing with their experiences, they can get help, and they are specifically being told THAT IT WILL NOT AFFECT THEIR CARREERS AND THAT EVERYTHING IS CONFIDENTIAL. We expect some people to have it. There's no reason for it to affect their carreers.i understand that, but i also understand that when private joe blow goes to his appointment every wednesday at 1400, that everyone that works with him knows about it, so that means that before long, everyone in the unit will know it, and even though it doesn't officially hamper your career, it most certainly can have an effect.

Not really. If he's a an E-4 or below, cutting score is based on PFT, pros/cons/ time in grade, and time in service of which medical care don't play a part, infact he may get a reprieve for some of the dumb stuff he may have done before if the platoon commander decides to cut him some slack because it may be related to PTSD.

Also, for E-5's and above like me, the new process for fitreps is pretty stringent, and not open to much interpretation. There is no section dealing even remotely with medical history during the period covered, and staff NCO selection boards do not have access to medical records.

They shouldn't catch any crap about it at work. It's kind of an unwritten rule that the guys with PTSD aren't made fun of and are generally given a lot of slack. Anything else is looked upon as severely poor taste, and those that show such behaviour will have their promotions affected.

Any lingering stigmas to getting help are part of being a member of the human race, and there's not anything our government can do about that short of giving every American a lobotomy. :shrug:

First the Pentagon sends them to war then they turn their backs on the psychiatrically wounded.
Getting back on topic, this post bugs me the most out of any here. I think we've proven without a doubt that the govt is not turning their backs on the psychologically wounded.

Not really. If he's a an E-4 or below, cutting score is based on PFT, pros/cons/ time in grade, and time in service of which medical care don't play a part, infact he may get a reprieve for some of the dumb stuff he may have done before if the platoon commander decides to cut him some slack because it may be related to PTSD.

Also, for E-5's and above like me, the new process for fitreps is pretty stringent, and not open to much interpretation. There is no section dealing even remotely with medical history during the period covered, and staff NCO selection boards do not have access to medical records.

They shouldn't catch any crap about it at work. It's kind of an unwritten rule that the guys with PTSD aren't made fun of and are generally given a lot of slack. Anything else is looked upon as severely poor taste, and those that show such behaviour will have their promotions affected.

Any lingering stigmas to getting help are part of being a member of the human race, and there's not anything our government can do about that short of giving every American a lobotomy. :shrug:
good to hear. :nice:

Nearly four in five service members returning from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan who were found to be at risk for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) were never referred by government clinicians for further help, according to a Government Accountability Office report due for release today.

The report says Defense Department officials were unable to explain why only some troops were referred for help. Many veterans groups have accused the government of playing down the risk of PTSD because of concerns over skyrocketing costs.

In all, 9,145 of 178,664 service members who took the screening test were found to be at risk. Of those at risk, 22 percent were referred for help. The Army and Air Force each referred 23 percent of those at risk, the Navy 18 percent and the Marines about 15 percent, according to a draft of the report obtained by The Washington Post.

Questions that need answering

Why are only some referred for help WHY NOT ALL?
If the screening test showed they were at risk don't we owe them better treatment?

Nearly four in five service members returning from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan who were found to be at risk for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) were never referred by government clinicians for further help, according to a Government Accountability Office report due for release today.

The report says Defense Department officials were unable to explain why only some troops were referred for help. Many veterans groups have accused the government of playing down the risk of PTSD because of concerns over skyrocketing costs.

In all, 9,145 of 178,664 service members who took the screening test were found to be at risk. Of those at risk, 22 percent were referred for help. The Army and Air Force each referred 23 percent of those at risk, the Navy 18 percent and the Marines about 15 percent, according to a draft of the report obtained by The Washington Post.

Questions that need answering

Why are only some referred for help WHY NOT ALL?
If the screening test showed they were at risk don't we owe them better treatment?
i think before we even adress those questions, we need to know what we're asking.exactly what is a "referral"? on active duty there are many outlets for help, and no referral is needed. does a referral mean they were ordered to see a shrink? were thay given the name of shrink? were they written out a fromal refferal to take to the shrink? were those not given a referral told to seek help but refused?

Jwreck makes a good point. What does the reporter consider a "referral"?

Honestly, everyone is given the oppurtunity, and everyone diagnosed is given the option. Nobody can be forced to go unless they pose a serious risk of homocide or suicide. By that logic, referrals are 100%.

SimoneAsLily, the source you are getting your information from is either lying, or using the word "referral" in a very creative fasion, as in a referral meaning someone is forced to go. That would match you numbers.

Nobody with PTSD is being turned away. That's a solid fact, and anyone who tells you otherwise is lying.

When in the history of the United States of AMerica have veterans been treated properly?

Never. I think vets deserve better treatment in a LOT of areas, BUT...

If you're gonna point this out, at least do it with actual facts, not the :bs: that was stated in post #1 and #16.

Misleading statements like that take away credibility from the real arguments concerning veteran issues.

The pentagon's rejoinder.

Pentagon Faults Report Questioning Veterans' Mental Health Care

By Shankar Vedantam
Washington Post Staff Writer
Saturday, May 13, 2006; Page A09

The Pentagon's top medical officer yesterday contested the conclusions of a Government Accountability Office report that questioned whether service members returning from Iraq and Afghanistan are getting appropriate mental health care.

Although the report said only 22 percent of service members identified as at risk for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) on a post-deployment questionnaire were referred for a mental health examination, that did not account for troops who were referred to primary care physicians or other treatment providers for mental health care, said William Winkenwerder Jr., assistant secretary of defense for health affairs.

"Many people are referred and were referred in this process not to a mental health professional but to a primary care professional, their doctor," said Winkenwerder in an interview. "They were referred to group counseling sessions, or a [confidential counseling] service or a chaplain.

Yea, all those Vietnam veterans are in such good shape. Who needs "screenings" and "treatments" for things? Medical care is mostly superstitious crap anyways. The Veterans Administration should be taken out of the federal budget and the money put to better use.


-

Yea, all those Vietnam veterans are in such good shape. Who needs "screenings" and "treatments" for things? Medical care is mostly superstitious crap anyways. The Veterans Administration should be taken out of the federal budget and the money put to better use.


-
Dude, you just broke my sarcastometer

Tell me , Betty , whats's BS about it?

Do you think that approx 10,000 out of approx 180,000 could be at risk for PTSD is BS?

Agreeing with jwreck that we don't know what a referral is do you think that referring ALL AT RISK would be BS?

Do you think that treating our soldiers with honor ,respect, dignity is BS?

Do you think being at risk for PTSD is BS?

Tell me , Betty , whats's BS about it?

Do you think that approx 10,000 out of approx 180,000 could be at risk for PTSD is BS?

Agreeing with jwreck that we don't know what a referral is do you think that referring ALL AT RISK would be BS?

Do you think that treating our soldiers with honor ,respect, dignity is BS?

Do you think being at risk for PTSD is BS?

What's BS is the source. What's BS is twisting the facts to make it look like today's troops with PTSD are being ignored and tossed aside when I personally have witnessed that that is not the fact at all. Read my posts and sit and think for a minute about what I'm saying before you throw accusations around. Take off your blinders and realize that the media is after ratings, not the truth. You can trust the crooked media or you can trust someone who is currently in the military, personally knows people with PTSD, and has firsthand knowledge of THE TRUTH about what is REALLY going on.

You can copy and paste a bunch of reports stating that the sky is hot pink with green and purple polkadot clouds, but those won't convince me either since I can simply look up and see the truth.

Reality or the media. Your choice sweety.

What's BS is the source. What's BS is twisting the facts to make it look like today's troops with PTSD are being ignored and tossed aside when I personally have witnessed that that is not the fact at all. Read my posts and sit and think for a minute about what I'm saying before you throw accusations around. Take off your blinders and realize that the media is after ratings, not the truth. You can trust the crooked media or you can trust someone who is currently in the military, personally knows people with PTSD, and has firsthand knowledge of THE TRUTH about what is REALLY going on.

You can copy and paste a bunch of reports stating that the sky is hot pink with green and purple polkadot clouds, but those won't convince me either since I can simply look up and see the truth.

Reality or the media. Your choice sweety.

LOL a little touchy aren't we?

I made no accusations , dude .
Was just trying to figure out what was BS.
So the source is BS. Glad you clarified that.

Maybe or not who knows. The media is certainly capable of twisting facts as is the government capable of not telling the whole truth. And as far as veteran benefits - enough said.

I still firmly believe that any service person identified as being at risk for PTSD should get professional mental help. PTSD isn't something to ignore no matter how major or minor.

LOL a little touchy aren't we?

I made no accusations , dude .


Do you think that treating our soldiers with honor ,respect, dignity is BS?

Do you think being at risk for PTSD is BS?
Well for obvious reasons, the above statements would strike any reasonable person as either accusations or baiting. Surely you can see that. It's especially disheartening considering that in post #13 I said:
They shouldn't catch any crap about it at work. It's kind of an unwritten rule that the guys with PTSD aren't made fun of and are generally given a lot of slack. Anything else is looked upon as severely poor taste, and those that show such behaviour will have their promotions affected.
...which tells me you just skimmed my post instead of reading.

I still firmly believe that any service person identified as being at risk for PTSD should get professional mental help. PTSD isn't something to ignore no matter how major or minor.

Agreed.