Let's starve 'em for being too greedy.

Let's starve 'em for being too greedy.

I'd rather support a successful company. If I like their product, I'll buy it. If they overprice compared to the competition and don't offer any value added services, I won't.

I'd rather support a successful company.

A successful company that charges 3 bucks a gallon while achieving record breaking profits. Yeah, that's my idea of success alright.

hadit, don't you get it? :confused: Don't Buy!

Oh yeah, we'll drive them into bankrupcy!! :rolleyes:

what we need is more competition in the oil market. we need new companies to compete with the big ones. the gov't never should have allowed exxon and mobil to merge, nor should they have allowed chevron and texaco to merge...

Oh yeah, we'll drive them into bankrupcy!! :rolleyes:

Or we can force them to lower their prices. I'm fine with either outcome. It can be done!

Or we can force them to lower their prices. I'm fine with either outcome. It can be done!

not with artificial gimmicks like you're suggesting.

not with artificial gimmicks like you're suggesting.

A gimmick? No gimmick. Boycotts are real and they work. But there must be full participation and an unshakeable commitment.

A gimmick? No gimmick. Boycotts are real and they work. But there must be full participation and an unmovable commitment.

yeah, good luck with that. :rolleyes:

lemme know how it works out. in the meantime, I'll be filling up my tank with whatever is cheapest.

Lol, like they aren't all wallet snatchers...

yeah, good luck with that. :rolleyes:

lemme know how it works out. in the meantime, I'll be filling up my tank with whatever is cheapest.

How muchh cheaper is Exxon Mobil gonna be right now, 10 cents? You're not seeing the big picture.

Lol, like they aren't all wallet snatchers...

I agree, they are. So you pick one to starve, and watch what happens to the prices. If Exxon Mobil isn't selling any gas, they're not making any money. That's their meat and potatoes. It's called forcing their hand (they're doing a good job already of forcing ours).

You have to be willing to shake things up if you want change. You have to at least try. It will work!

The fact that there are numerous alternatives (well, at least where I'm at there is) besides Exxon Mobil makes a boycott like this much easier.

Where I live we have BP, Amoco, Marathon, Shell, Fast Track, Citgo, Speedway, Sunoco. That's 8 right there off the top of my head. I live in the suburbs and Mobil is usually the highest anyway.

The fact that there are numerous alternatives (well, at least where I'm at there is) besides Exxon Mobil makes a boycott like this much easier.
News covered this 2 days ago, and the one you hurt is the gas station owner. Exxon will just sell their gas through other outlets. Besides, are you suggest to buy more expensive gas, even if Exxon is cheaper, just because the company's profit is higher? You want to reward those who run worse business, go ahead.

The economic realities of the universe will make your plan fail.

First of all, people won't spend extra money on gas just because they believe in some high ideal about sticking it to Exxon/Mobil. You may value your ideals above your wallet, but 99.99% of humanity does not.

Second, EVEN IF you could get everyone to boycott Exxon/Mobil, that would just cause the other gas sellers to raise their prices in accordance with the higher demand they are experiencing. So ultimately you'd just be making a donation to Exxon/Mobil's compeditors. Then you'd probably get mad at them for posting record profits and you'd wanna boycott them, too.

Ultimately, your plan does nothing to increase supply nor decrease demand of gasoline, so it will do nothing to lower the average price of gas.

what we need is more competition in the oil market. we need new companies to compete with the big ones. the gov't never should have allowed exxon and mobil to merge, nor should they have allowed chevron and texaco to merge...

DING DING DING!!!

We're returning to the days of Standard Oil, and nobody in the government seems to give two shits (or even one, it seems) about the antitrust laws.

I never buy exxon/mobil products, and I tend to support local refiners whenever possible (i.e. sunoco). Exxon stations are rarely the cheapest gig in towns in PA.

News covered this 2 days ago, and the one you hurt is the gas station owner.

There's also gas station owners that are refusing to sell gas due to the high prices in protest. I saw that on the news too.


Exxon will just sell their gas through other outlets.

What other outlets? If that happens, still don't buy it.

Besides, are you suggest to buy more expensive gas, even if Exxon is cheaper, just because the company's profit is higher? You want to reward those who run worse business, go ahead.

Yes, but not because their profit is higher. What's the price variance of gas in your community? My area it's about 3-7 cents.

For example, if the price of Mobil (or Exxon) 89 is 2.97, and the service station across the street has it for 3.02, you purchase the gas across the street. It's merely a 5 cent difference. Now it just so happens that where I live Mobil is usually the most expensive virtually all the time. Even if it were cheapest, I still wouldn't buy it. You can't sacrifice 5 cent on a gallon for a greater gain? I can, and I think it's worth it.

Let's starve 'em for being too greedy.

You've got to be shitting me dude! LMAO, good luck with your little adventure.

While you're at it maybe you can convince lawmakers to create some little extortion scam against big oil like they did tabacco. The government always needs more money.

First of all, people won't spend extra money on gas just because they believe in some high ideal about sticking it to Exxon/Mobil. You may value your ideals above your wallet, but 99.99% of humanity does not.

I do this, and i know many other people with the same principles. Im willing to pay several cents extra for non-exxon/mobil. I have done it, and i will continue to do it until that trust is busted.


Second, EVEN IF you could get everyone to boycott Exxon/Mobil, that would just cause the other gas sellers to raise their prices in accordance with the higher demand they are experiencing. So ultimately you'd just be making a donation to Exxon/Mobil's compeditors. Then you'd probably get mad at them for posting record profits and you'd wanna boycott them, too.

This is not entirely accurate. Other gas sellers would probably start buying Exxon's excess capacity and begin selling it through their own stations - people would pay for exxon gas regardless because the gas will not expire and isnt too hard to transport.

The aim of the boycott is to aid in the destruction of an anti-capitalist monopoly which would, in the long run, make gas prices more accurately affect their true market value.

You've got to be shitting me dude! LMAO, good luck with your little adventure.


Good things work in numbers man. If a boycott worked and the price of oil/gas dropped substantially, you'd be one of the 1st in line to get your cheaper gas.

Good things work in numbers man. If a boycott worked and the price of oil/gas dropped substantially, you'd be one of the 1st in line to get your cheaper gas.

You obviously haven't thought this through.

Why do you think prices would drop across the board? Because all the other gas companies would have to lower their prices to compete with Exxon/Mobil? Well they wouldn't, because they wouldn't need to compete with Exxon/Mobil, because nobody would be getting their gas from Exxon/Mobil, because of the boycott!

The oil companies will charge a high a price as they think the public will pay. One less company in the mix ain't gonna change the prices. If anything, the government would use your tax money to bail their broke asses out of bankrupcy.

Government rakes in more money on every gallon of gas than the oil company does. Why isn't anyone trying to get the government to lower its take and consequently the price of gasoline? Why is the private sector supposed to do with less when the government NEVER does?

You obviously haven't thought this through.

Why do you think prices would drop across the board? Because all the other gas companies would have to lower their prices to compete with Exxon/Mobil? Well they wouldn't, because they wouldn't need to compete with Exxon/Mobil, because nobody would be getting their gas from Exxon/Mobil, because of the boycott!

The idea is to force somebody's hand, in this case Mobil's, and cause them to lower their prices due to a lack of sales. When they lower their price substantially, then we buy as much gas as we possibly can from them which will in turn lower the sales of the other oil companies, causing them to have to compete with Exxon Mobil's subsequent lower gas prices.

The idea is to force somebody's hand, in this case Mobil's, and cause them to lower their prices due to a lack of sales. When they lower their price substantially, then we buy as much gas as we possibly can from them which will in turn lower the sales of the other oil companies, causing them to have to compete with Exxon Mobil's subsequent lower gas prices.

Once you go back to buying Exxon/Mobil gas, the Exxon/Mobil prices will go right back to where they are now.

This is all assuming that you could get millions of people to buy into your little scam, which you can't.

Once you go back to buying Exxon/Mobil gas, the Exxon/Mobil prices will go right back to where they are now.

Then you repeat the process over again.

Good things work in numbers man. If a boycott worked and the price of oil/gas dropped substantially, you'd be one of the 1st in line to get your cheaper gas.

You're argument is based on the presumption that oil companies ARE the cause of the problem. Boycotting service stations is no more than an attack on your local convenience store.

You're argument is based on the presumption that oil companies ARE the cause of the problem. Boycotting service stations is no more than an attack on your local convenience store.

Exactly. High gas prices are caused by market fluctuations, lack of refining capacity, government's insatiable appetite for tax revenue, EPA regulations, supply restrictions, and most recently, the fear of terrorist caused supply disruptions. I would think that greens and liberals in general would rejoice when gas prices rise because it forces people to cut back on their usage and look into alternative sources. I guess it's because the government doesn't get the extra money. I base that observation on the fact that whenever gas prices go down and legislators start talking about 50 cent/gallon tax increases, you don't hear a peep of protest from them, but boy, let a private company earn an extra 50 cents/gallon and they freak.

You're argument is based on the presumption that oil companies ARE the cause of the problem. Boycotting service stations is no more than an attack on your local convenience store.

There are gas station owners themselves who have stopped selling gas in protest of the high prices. I saw this on the news this past weekend.

But ultimately, in the bigger scheme of things, somethings got to give. That's just how it is.

The idea is to force somebody's hand, in this case Mobil's, and cause them to lower their prices due to a lack of sales. When they lower their price substantially, then we buy as much gas as we possibly can from them which will in turn lower the sales of the other oil companies, causing them to have to compete with Exxon Mobil's subsequent lower gas prices.
You aren't going to change anything boycotting an American company when oil prices are regulated on a worldwide market.

You aren't going to change anything boycotting an American company when oil prices are regulated on a worldwide market.

You have to go after what you can realistically go after to effect change.

Let me say this. In order for Exxon to make money, they ultimately have to sell you a product (as it stands today). When the product they're selling is no longer being bought, something has to take place. Sitting on ones collective rear end isn't working right now, so what have you got to lose? Somethings got to happen. I think the price of gas is too high, so I'm willing to effect change. Sitting on our butts has done nothing to effect change. What have we got to lose. How much extra energy will it take to simply go to another gas station?

SPREAD THE WORD!

Then you repeat the process over again.

so you pay more for gas for a while, then pay less for about a day, then repeat the process. :|

why don't you just write a donation check to Chevron/Texaco. I'm sure they'll appreciate it. In the meantime, I, and hundreds of millions of consumers like me, will be buying my gas wherever it's cheapest.

You have to go after what you can realistically go after to effect change.

Let me say this. In order for Exxon to make money, they ultimately have to sell you a product (as it stands today). When the product they're selling is no longer being bought, something has to take place. Sitting on ones collective rear end isn't working right now, so what have you got to lose? Somethings got to happen. I think the price of gas is too high, so I'm willing to effect change. Sitting on our butts has done nothing to effect change. What have we got to lose.

The price of gas will continue to rise, and it isn't Exxon's fault. Look globally my friend...and see what is going on.
When rig-hands are making $30-40 bucks an hour here to suck oil from the earth, I cannot see it getting cheaper at the pumps as a result of you choosing to purchase your products from another oil warlord. Industry is the biggest user, and if you can make manufacturers & transporters decide to boycott Exxon, you may actually make a drop in the bucket.
Good luck, let us know how it goes.

The price of gas will continue to rise, and it isn't Exxon's fault. Look globally my friend...and see what is going on.
When rig-hands are making $30-40 bucks an hour here to suck oil from the earth, I cannot see it getting cheaper at the pumps as a result of you choosing to purchase your products from another oil warlord. Industry is the biggest user, and if you can make manufacturers & transporters decide to boycott Exxon, you may actually make a drop in the bucket.
Good luck, let us know how it goes.


How do you figure that Exxon is blameless when theyr'e one of several oil companies that recorded record high profits coincidentally since the price of gas has increased?

Voting with one's purchasing dollars is perfectly acceptable. If veracity wishes to avoid XOM's products, he is just exercising his property and freedom of association rights.

:nice:

How do you figure that Exxon is blameless when theyr'e one of several oil companies that recorded record high profits coincidentally since the price of gas has increased?

The governments of many countires where oil companies reside also make huge dollars with higher oil prices. Banks make huge profits off of us, as does Walmart, McDonald's and many other companies. It is the nature of a business to make profits. Singling out one company out of millions and thinking they are the cause of the woes in the world is pretty strange.
Like I said, oil prices are regulated worldwide, so don't expect your boycott to mean anything.

what we need is more competition in the oil market. we need new companies to compete with the big ones. the gov't never should have allowed exxon and mobil to merge, nor should they have allowed chevron and texaco to merge...
more competition :nice:

I swear, some of you guys are acting like we have to take drastic measures and lay in front of tanker trucks at service stations in order to prevent them from refilling. When in reality all you have to do is choose another brand name.


The fundamental question is do you think a successful international boycott of Exxon Mobil products will have an impact on the cost of the gasoline that they supply us with? I think it will.

Yep. A successful boycott would cause a Global Recession - and then prices would naturally fall because of a fall in demand due to people not having jobs/income.

:nice:

The fundamental question is do you think a successful international boycott of Exxon Mobil products will have an impact on the cost of the gasoline that they supply us with? I think it will.

The only reason Exxon/Mobile reports higher profits than Chevron/Texaco is because they sell more gas. The profit margins for both are probably the same. If you successfully boycotted one, you would just be helping the other.

The problem is that we have TOO FEW oil companies from which to choose. And you want to limit your choices even further? That's just silly.

Crude oil prices are determined by global supply and demand conditions in international markets. The production policies of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) help determine global supply availability and these policies have an important influence on world oil prices. As a cartel, OPEC attempts to maintain oil prices by restricting its production. Its ability to do so depends on prevailing market conditions, the degree of co-operation from non-OPEC oil producing countries, and its own cohesiveness.

http://www.energy.gov.on.ca/index.cfm?fuseaction=oilandgas.faqs&subtopic=gaspricing

There you go, veracity00, write OPEC a letter demanding lower prices!

Crude oil prices are determined by global supply and demand conditions in international markets. The production policies of the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) help determine global supply availability and these policies have an important influence on world oil prices. As a cartel, OPEC attempts to maintain oil prices by restricting its production. Its ability to do so depends on prevailing market conditions, the degree of co-operation from non-OPEC oil producing countries, and its own cohesiveness.

http://www.energy.gov.on.ca/index.cfm?fuseaction=oilandgas.faqs&subtopic=gaspricing

There you go, veracity00, write OPEC a letter demanding lower prices!

How do you explain Exxon Mobil making record high profits if things are so bad in the oil business today?

How do you explain Exxon Mobil making record high profits if things are so bad in the oil business today?

Who said anything in the oil business is bad? Oil companies in North America, and all the companies that do business along with them, are all making a fortune. The entire city I live in is oil-based...everything here caters to the oil industry...and things are booming.

Who said anything in the oil business is bad? Oil companies in North America, and all the companies that do business along with them, are all making a fortune. The entire city I live in is oil-based...everything here caters to the oil industry...and things are booming.

Going after OPEC intially would fail. OPEC is too big a tree to chop down.

Myst, if you feel like you'll be adversely affected by this boycott of Exxon Mobil then don't do it. But if it won't cost you anything major to select an alternative source of gasoline then why not give it a shot.

Going after OPEC intially would fail. OPEC is too big a tree to chop down.

Myst, if you feel like you'll be adversely affected by this boycott of Exxon Mobil then don't do it. But if it won't cost you anything major to select an alternative source of gasoline then why not give it a shot.

Lol, we all have a right to boycott whatever company we like, but don't expect it to do anything.
In Alberta, we've had a couple of 'don't buy gas' days that start at a grassroots level...word gets around via internet & newspapers...the idea is that if nobody buys gas on any given day, it would scare the companies into lowering prices. ( We pay the highest prices in the nation.)
It has yet to have any impact. :shrug:

I don't even recall seeing Exxon gas stations. I always go to the racetrac or QT

I don't even recall seeing Exxon gas stations. I always go to the racetrac or QT Find out who owns them and who supplys their gas.

Exactly. High gas prices are caused by market fluctuations, lack of refining capacity, government's insatiable appetite for tax revenue, EPA regulations, supply restrictions, and most recently, the fear of terrorist caused supply disruptions. I would think that greens and liberals in general would rejoice when gas prices rise because it forces people to cut back on their usage and look into alternative sources. I guess it's because the government doesn't get the extra money. I base that observation on the fact that whenever gas prices go down and legislators start talking about 50 cent/gallon tax increases, you don't hear a peep of protest from them, but boy, let a private company earn an extra 50 cents/gallon and they freak.


LOL, the oil cartels must love it that there are people out there foolish enough to believe in this nonsense.

The automotive industry is faced with the same realities that the oil industry is faced with, and cars haven't tripled in price in the last 3 years.

But then, the automotive companies don't engage in price fixing like the oil companies and their refineries do.

This is a case where the government must step in, and it is because gasoline is a necessity, gas isn't a pair of fancy shoes or a luxury item like a plasma screen TV. Our country is built around the automobile, we have no public transportation, we live in vast cities where things are spread far apart from one another. We can't just stop buying gas, we need it, we can choose to buy a cheap 27" old school tube television if we are shopping for a television and we are tight on cash. We can buy some cheap shoes from a number of different discount shoe outlets if we are tight on cash rather than buying expensive designer shoes only.

Now one of you apologists for these criminals please tell us all where we can go buy a cheap gallon of gas from the discount gas station?? Oh you can't, since it doesn't exist because our government which is owned by huge corporations (corporatism) will not enforce Antitrust laws which were designed to keep a few wealthy corporations from buying up their competition and rigging the system like the oil cartels do now.

It's no different than the lunatic who argues in NAMBLA's favor, or in favor of robbers, criminal activity is ciminal activity. Just because a certain priveliged elite are filthy rich or strut around in suits instead of baggy jeans and Ben Davis pullovers doesn't mean they should be above the laws and the welfare of the country.

I have to question the loyalties of those who put the bank account size of white collar criminals over the survival of their own country. They must be insane and or morally bankrupt, nothing else makes sense.

We're stuck with Standard oil all over again and nobody gives a damn, well, until the middle class has to choose between filling up their tank and food on the table, the poor are already making that decision in this bestest wonderfulest toughest #1 nation on Earth!!!.

:nonono: :nonono: :nonono: :nonono: :nonono:

LOL, the oil cartels must love it that there are people out there foolish enough to believe in this nonsense.

The automotive industry is faced with the same realities that the oil industry is faced with, and cars haven't tripled in price in the last 3 years.


Balony. The automotive industry doesn't face the reality of the terror premium, or the lack of production capacity, nor do they face the huge tax bite government takes from every gallon of gasoline. You're comparing two things that have little in common. In addition, the auto industry doesn't face the government preventing them from utilizing raw materials that are local and readily available, like it does with oil.


But then, the automotive companies don't engage in price fixing like the oil companies and their refineries do.

This is a case where the government must step in, and it is because gasoline is a necessity, gas isn't a pair of fancy shoes or a luxury item like a plasma screen TV. Our country is built around the automobile, we have no public transportation, we live in vast cities where things are spread far apart from one another. We can't just stop buying gas, we need it, we can choose to buy a cheap 27" old school tube television if we are shopping for a television and we are tight on cash. We can buy some cheap shoes from a number of different discount shoe outlets if we are tight on cash rather than buying expensive designer shoes only.

Now one of you apologists for these criminals please tell us all where we can go buy a cheap gallon of gas from the discount gas station?? Oh you can't, since it doesn't exist because our government which is owned by huge corporations (corporatism) will not enforce Antitrust laws which were designed to keep a few wealthy corporations from buying up their competition and rigging the system like the oil cartels do now.


I consistently find gas at up to 10cents/gallon less than what most gas stations charge, because I do find the discount stations. You're making the charge of price fixing, prove it.


It's no different than the lunatic who argues in NAMBLA's favor, or in favor of robbers, criminal activity is ciminal activity. Just because a certain priveliged elite are filthy rich or strut around in suits instead of baggy jeans and Ben Davis pullovers doesn't mean they should be above the laws and the welfare of the country.


Again, prove criminal activity. Someone making money is not proof.


I have to question the loyalties of those who put the bank account size of white collar criminals over the survival of their own country. They must be insane and or morally bankrupt, nothing else makes sense.


The solution is obvious. We have to drill in Alaska, the Gulf of Mexico and off the coasts of Florida and California. We also have to build more refineries, lots of them.


We're stuck with Standard oil all over again and nobody gives a damn, well, until the middle class has to choose between filling up their tank and food on the table, the poor are already making that decision in this bestest wonderfulest toughest #1 nation on Earth!!!.

:nonono: :nonono: :nonono: :nonono: :nonono:

The government stepping in and forcing Exxon Mobile to sell gasoline at a cheap price will do these things:

1. Ensure that we WILL see gasoline shortages and rationing.
2. Ultimately NOT work, and prices will climb higher than ever.
3. Send us down the road toward fascism.
4. Kill the oil industry in the US, making us even MORE dependent on foreign oil.

Honestly, I find the act of knowingly buying products from businesses you know act despicably, especially when there are alternatives, to be pretty damn despicable as well.

Also, stop whining, gas prices in Norway are about $2 per liter :P

Honestly, I find the act of knowingly buying products from businesses you know act despicably, especially when there are alternatives, to be pretty damn despicable as well.
Despicable because Exxon sell you gas at the same or cheaper price than those alternatives? If there is a price fixing, Exxon cannot do it alone.

Lol, we all have a right to boycott whatever company we like, but don't expect it to do anything.
In Alberta, we've had a couple of 'don't buy gas' days that start at a grassroots level...word gets around via internet & newspapers...the idea is that if nobody buys gas on any given day, it would scare the companies into lowering prices. ( We pay the highest prices in the nation.)
It has yet to have any impact. :shrug:

The idea of boycotting 1, just 1 major oil company (every day of the week) will get better results than what you guys were doing in Canada. Again I ask, what have we got to lose.

Balony. The automotive industry doesn't face the reality of the terror premium, or the lack of production capacity, nor do they face the huge tax bite government takes from every gallon of gasoline. You're comparing two things that have little in common. In addition, the auto industry doesn't face the government preventing them from utilizing raw materials that are local and readily available, like it does with oil...

hadit, do you own any stock in the oil companies?

you can go on and on and on, but there's 1 thing you can't deny regardless of how big of a risk and a "terror premium" you state the oil companies assume when they choose to set up shop in oil rich countries. Actually, it is the oil companies who are partly to blame for what you call a terror premium!

The 1 thing you can't deny is that the oil companies are making record profits, and gas is expensive as hell. Do you think that the prices we're paying at the pump has contributed to these record breaking profits?
Hell yeah it has!

TIME TO BOYCOTT EXXON MOBIL, AND I ALREADY HAVE STARTED.

:rofl:

Despicable because Exxon sell you gas at the same or cheaper price than those alternatives? If there is a price fixing, Exxon cannot do it alone.
I'm disliking Exxon mobile for other reasons. But I don't own a car, so it doesn't really matter :p

hadit, do you own any stock in the oil companies?


No. It's possible that one of my retirement funds is in one of them, but I don't personally own any stock.


you can go on and on and on, but there's 1 thing you can't deny regardless of how big of a risk and a "terror premium" you state the oil companies assume when they choose to set up shop in oil rich countries. Actually, it is the oil companies who are partly to blame for what you call a terror premium!


And why do they set up shop in oil rich countries? Could it be because THAT'S WHERE THE OIL IS? Or could it be because the eco-freaks have made it nearly impossible to explore for oil in our own country? You might as well be angry that we don't buy bananas from Alaska.


The 1 thing you can't deny is that the oil companies are making record profits, and gas is expensive as hell. Do you think that the prices we're paying at the pump has contributed to these record breaking profits?
Hell yeah it has!

TIME TO BOYCOTT EXXON MOBIL, AND I ALREADY HAVE STARTED.

Gas is expensive for many reasons, and Exxon Mobil is not the primary cause. Enjoy your little boycott. There is Mobil station very close to my home that is selling gas at 15 cents/gallon less than all the other local stations. I'll compensate for your boycott.

The oil companies don't set the prices or production of crude oil. The cartels and the markets do.

The average margin for the oil companies is about 8%, regardless of barrell price. If prices go up, naturally they earn more money.

The ideas being proposed to impose a windfall profit tax is idiotic, and will only drive fuelk prices higher, because they'll be passed down to the consumer. That's how it works.

I don't hear any state or federal officials proposing to eliminate their tax revenue on fuel, which is at least 50 cents a gallon anywhere in the country.

We need refineries and more drilling here at home. We have lots of untapped fuel just waiting to be pumped out of the ground. The politicians fear the environmentalists so much that everyone has to pay, and it time to end that foolish policy. Someone should get some guts, stop taking their money, change our energy policy, and stop worrying about what the minority thinks about it. Otherwise, gas will be 6 bucks a gallon before we know it.

And why do they set up shop in oil rich countries? Could it be because THAT'S WHERE THE OIL IS?

Yes it is. And that's also where the oil spills are, and all the other negative things that lead to the instability and the uprisings that take place in these countries, because the citizens of these countries feel as if the multinational countries are exploiting them.

Or could it be because the eco-freaks have made it nearly impossible to explore for oil in our own country? You might as well be angry that we don't buy bananas from Alaska.

Well continue to blame who you want, it's not changing anything now.

Gas is expensive for many reasons, and Exxon Mobil is not the primary cause.

It doesn't matter if they're the primary cause. The Montgomery bus system wasn't primarily the cause of the segregation that existed in Alabama in the 60's, but the boycott made a significant impact on what the primary causes of segregation were.

There is Mobil station very close to my home that is selling gas at 15 cents/gallon less than all the other local stations. I'll compensate for your boycott.

Where do you live?

The oil companies don't set the prices or production of crude oil. The cartels and the markets do.

The average margin for the oil companies is about 8%, regardless of barrell price. If prices go up, naturally they earn more money.

The ideas being proposed to impose a windfall profit tax is idiotic, and will only drive fuelk prices higher, because they'll be passed down to the consumer. That's how it works.

I don't hear any state or federal officials proposing to eliminate their tax revenue on fuel, which is at least 50 cents a gallon anywhere in the country.

We need refineries and more drilling here at home. We have lots of untapped fuel just waiting to be pumped out of the ground. The politicians fear the environmentalists so much that everyone has to pay, and it time to end that foolish policy. Someone should get some guts, stop taking their money, change our energy policy, and stop worrying about what the minority thinks about it. Otherwise, gas will be 6 bucks a gallon before we know it.

Betrade, Exxon Mobil is making record profits while we have record high gas prices. That's all I need to know in order to conclude that something is wrong with this picture. There may be other methods besides a boycott of Exxon Mobil that will also effect change. I happen to think this is the best idea I've heard so far. What do we have to lose.

The oil companies don't set the prices or production of crude oil. The cartels and the markets do.

The average margin for the oil companies is about 8%, regardless of barrell price. If prices go up, naturally they earn more money.




The Government takes more per gallon of gas sold than the oil companies earn.

The Government takes more per gallon of gas sold than the oil companies earn.

The gov't does take whatever it takes. Are you suggesting they're in cahoots with the oil companies?

Yes it is. And that's also where the oil spills are, and all the other negative things that lead to the instability and the uprisings that take place in these countries, because the citizens of these countries feel as if the multinational countries are exploiting them.


:rofl:

I got news for yah, the middle east was ****ed up for thousands of years prior to the invention of the internal combustion engine. They just didn't have any money until the oil became valuable.


oh yeah, and what the **** is a multinational country?

The Government takes more per gallon of gas sold than the oil companies earn.boycott the government!

boycott the government!

Whatever it takes, but how hard would that be?

Whatever it takes though.

:rofl:

I got news for yah, the middle east was ****ed up for thousands of years prior to the invention of the internal combustion engine. They just didn't have any money until the oil became valuable.

Whatever. Take some time to review the discussion and you will see how irrelevant your remarks were.


oh yeah, and what the **** is a multinational country?

Look it up. It's in the dictionary.

Yes it is. And that's also where the oil spills are, and all the other negative things that lead to the instability and the uprisings that take place in these countries, because the citizens of these countries feel as if the multinational countries are exploiting them.


So there's really no need to be angry at an oil company for doing business where the oil is. What you're describing is an indictment of the entire oil industry, and has little to do with your target, Exxon. If you wanted to fight that problem, you would need to boycott the entire petroleum industry. Good luck living without gasoline, plastic, fresh food, and medicine.


Well continue to blame who you want, it's not changing anything now.


A perfect quote you should apply to Exxon Mobil.


It doesn't matter if they're the primary cause. The Montgomery bus system wasn't primarily the cause of the segregation that existed in Alabama in the 60's, but the boycott made a significant impact on what the primary causes of segregation were.


When you can prove that Exxon Mobil is engaged in unlawful/unethical behavior, there may be cause to boycott. So far, all they've done is make money and provide me with gasoline that is cheaper than the surrounding gas stations. I really have no gripe with them.


Where do you live?


30 miles outside a southern city.


Betrade, Exxon Mobil is making record profits while we have record high gas prices. That's all I need to know in order to conclude that something is wrong with this picture. There may be other methods besides a boycott of Exxon Mobil that will also effect change. I happen to think this is the best idea I've heard so far. What do we have to lose.

What we have to lose is the health of a company that is using a very successful business model and generating a lot of income for its employees and share-holders, not to mention a lot of tax revenue for the ever-insatiable federal government. They should be emulated, not condemned. If all the other oil companies were to operate as efficiently, Exxon Mobil would have to give up their large profit margins.

So there's really no need to be angry at an oil company for doing business where the oil is. What you're describing is an indictment of the entire oil industry, and has little to do with your target, Exxon.

I was merely replying to your post. So don't overextend my remarks to draw your own conclusions about how you think I feel.

If you wanted to fight that problem, you would need to boycott the entire petroleum industry. Good luck living without gasoline, plastic, fresh food, and medicine.

I got gas the other day, and I didn't go to Mobil to get it. It worked out ok.

When you can prove that Exxon Mobil is engaged in unlawful/unethical behavior, there may be cause to boycott.

I don't care about what legal rights Exxon Mobil has to charge these expensive prices for gas, while at the same time produce record breaking profits. Segregation was legal at one point, but that didn't mean that it was right and people should accept it.

So far, all they've done is make money and provide me with gasoline that is cheaper than the surrounding gas stations. I really have no gripe with them.

All the while the oil companies are recording record breaking profits. How much are you paying per gallon?

I'm expressing my disapproval of the current prices of gasoline period by participating in a boycott of Exxon Mobil products. I hope that this strategic boycott of Exxon Mobil products over time will result in the overall lowering of oil and gas prices in a substantial way across the board for all oil companies.

30 miles outside a southern city.

Urban or rural? How many service stations are in your community?

What we have to lose is the health of a company that is using a very successful business model and generating a lot of income for its employees and share-holders, not to mention a lot of tax revenue for the ever-insatiable federal government.

These oil companies aren't generating anything for me but a headache at the pump.

They should be emulated, not condemned. If all the other oil companies were to operate as efficiently, Exxon Mobil would have to give up their large profit margins.

Gas prices are all about the same where I live.

I don't care about what legal rights Exxon Mobil has to charge these expensive prices for gas, while at the same time produce record breaking profits. Segregation was legal at one point, but that didn't mean that it was right and people should accept it.


Has Exxon/Mobil even done anything unethical?

Has Exxon/Mobil even done anything unethical?

I feel like I'm being robbed at the pump.

what about other companies making record profits? Should we boycott any and all companies making record profits?

How much more is gas really costing you?

I got gas the other day, and I didn't go to Mobil to get it. It worked out ok.


So far, all I've seen is that they don't charge much if any more than other gas companies, yet are very profitable. That tells me that they are working much more efficiently than are the other companies and should be rewarded, not condemned, for that.


I don't care about what legal rights Exxon Mobil has to charge these expensive prices for gas, while at the same time produce record breaking profits. Segregation was legal at one point, but that didn't mean that it was right and people should accept it.


They aren't charging more than the other companies, so why pick on them? If it's because they are more profitable, see above.


All the while the oil companies are recording record breaking profits. How much are you paying per gallon?


At the Mobil station, $2.84/gallon. Everywhere else, except maybe at Sam's Club, $2.98/gallon.


I'm expressing my disapproval of the current prices of gasoline period by participating in a boycott of Exxon Mobil products. I hope that this strategic boycott of Exxon Mobil products over time will result in the overall lowering of oil and gas prices in a substantial way across the board for all oil companies.


They won't lower prices until their costs are lowered, and boycotting one company won't lower their costs. They still have to replace the oil they sell, remember, and if they sell at a lower price, they may not be able to afford to get more. In other words, these record profits could disappear quickly.


Urban or rural? How many service stations are in your community?


Semi-rural. I commute into the city, and pass 10-15 stations on the way.


These oil companies aren't generating anything for me but a headache at the pump.


You don't work for them or hold their stock. I don't either, but I also don't resent their profitability, knowing that it could vanish overnight, and all those raking it in now could lose their jobs.


Gas prices are all about the same where I live.

They vary, depending on how often a station has to fill its tanks. A major chain's prices aren't as volatile as a small one's are, so I see the little guys shoot up and down a lot faster than the big guy's. Right now they're going up faster than Exxon's.

what about other companies making record profits? Should we boycott any and all companies making record profits?

I've never boycotted anything up until now.

How much more is gas really costing you?

Too much in my opinion. Are you satisfied with the price of gasoline these days?

So far, all I've seen is that they don't charge much if any more than other gas companies, yet are very profitable. That tells me that they are working much more efficiently than are the other companies and should be rewarded, not condemned, for that.

That's all well and good. I just happen to believe that what I'm paying for gas is too much, and that I'm being overcharged. I also believe the oil companies are being overcompensated due to my being overcharged. And I don't think that I'm alone in believing this.

They aren't charging more than the other companies, so why pick on them? If it's because they are more profitable, see above.

I guess it was a random pick of a major oil company. I don't know of any analytical explanation for it. I read an email about it.

At the Mobil station, $2.84/gallon. Everywhere else, except maybe at Sam's Club, $2.98/gallon.

You're basically paying what I'm paying.


They won't lower prices until their costs are lowered, and boycotting one company won't lower their costs. They still have to replace the oil they sell, remember, and if they sell at a lower price, they may not be able to afford to get more. In other words, these record profits could disappear quickly.

What?


You don't work for them or hold their stock. I don't either, but I also don't resent their profitability, knowing that it could vanish overnight, and all those raking it in now could lose their jobs.

I resent the high price of gasoline. You defend the oil companies better than they defend themselves (NBC reported that the oil execs are having a hard time returning their calls). Are you failing to comprehend that we pay more so that they take more? Oil or gasoline can't be purchased like a pair of shoes where you shop according to how much you want to spend.

Furthermore, please express to me how you feel about the businesses and working families that are now being adversely affected by these high gas and oil prices. What about the gas station owners I heard about on Fox news that aren't selling any gas in protest of the high prices. Are you just as concerned about them too? Or is your concern just for the oil companies that basically charge you what they damn well please?

The Government takes more per gallon of gas sold than the oil companies earn.


Yup. The average price per gallon earned by oil companies is 5-8 cents per gallon, depending upon barrell price. stae, federal and local governments are getting 50 cents or more, regardless of barrell price.

The puiblic doesn't understand that oil is a commodity like sugar, coffee, pork bellies, etc. It's traded internationally, not only in the US, and what goes on in the world affects what traders are willing to pay. If they're nervous, the price goes up. When things are calm, and supply is high, they go down.

The oil comapnies themselves have nothing to do with the barrell price. they only have to earn about 6 bucks a barrell at the well to turn a profit.

No one was bashing Exxon when oil was at 15 bucks a barrell and they were spending billions on infrasrtucture worldwide, but noe that it's 75 bucks, it's suddenly their fault, when nothing could be farther from the truth.

Let's blame the monopoly that controls production, which in turn controls supply and demand. Let's blame the people who have record reserves on hand right now, yet keep it off of the market to keep prices artificially high.

A boycott won't work, because we need fuel to run the country. A few million dollars a day or week in lost sales won't affect anything whatsoever. people are already buying less as it is because the pricxes are high, yet everyone's getting richer.

And actually, the market is doing exactly what it's designed to do. A price increase lowers demand immediately, and changes the whole dynamic. It's like a market correction.

And actually, the market is doing exactly what it's designed to do. A price increase lowers demand immediately, and changes the whole dynamic. It's like a market correction.


The market is doing what it's designed to do given the interference of government.

- Big tax breaks (except for deductions for real R&D and capital investment) for oil companies are currently absurd. The fact that they mark up a commodity with high global demand takes an enormous amount of risk out of their business. A cost plus model ensures that their costs are covered. Making money this way is frightfully easy.

- Responsible management would plow profits back into alternative energy in order to prepare for the worsening oil supply-demand dynamic. Although there is a great deal of research going on, the fact that record profits are being posted means that more could be done in this regard. They are also able to bank these profits because of the government support aspect - so all this means is a shift of wealth from taxpayers to oil company shareholders.

- The shareholders are now addicted to the high prices and cost-plus margin generated profits. If the margin narrows, profits fall, and there goes the stock price. This is going to happen at some point. And then we will see more demands for government dollars to buffer the "bubble" bottom-line, with the "alternative energy investment requirement" being used as the excuse.

- Speculation in oil futures adds $5-$10 to a barrell price. The margin requirements to buy futures are absurdly low. As the government has a heavy hand in regulating financial and commodity markets, one must wonder why such low margin requirements are still in place.

Yup. The average price per gallon earned by oil companies is 5-8 cents per gallon, depending upon barrell price. stae, federal and local governments are getting 50 cents or more, regardless of barrell price.

The puiblic doesn't understand that oil is a commodity like sugar, coffee, pork bellies, etc. It's traded internationally, not only in the US, and what goes on in the world affects what traders are willing to pay. If they're nervous, the price goes up. When things are calm, and supply is high, they go down.

The oil comapnies themselves have nothing to do with the barrell price. they only have to earn about 6 bucks a barrell at the well to turn a profit.

No one was bashing Exxon when oil was at 15 bucks a barrell and they were spending billions on infrasrtucture worldwide, but noe that it's 75 bucks, it's suddenly their fault, when nothing could be farther from the truth.

Let's blame the monopoly that controls production, which in turn controls supply and demand. Let's blame the people who have record reserves on hand right now, yet keep it off of the market to keep prices artificially high.

A boycott won't work, because we need fuel to run the country. A few million dollars a day or week in lost sales won't affect anything whatsoever. people are already buying less as it is because the pricxes are high, yet everyone's getting richer.

And actually, the market is doing exactly what it's designed to do. A price increase lowers demand immediately, and changes the whole dynamic. It's like a market correction.

Betrade, I have 2 questions for you. Is there any cost for gasoline that you think would be unreasonable? If so, what would that price be?

The frustration with high prices is sending some people out into the streets. One group from DeKalb County is asking motorists to boycott big name gas stations and only gas up on certain days (see related story).

Emory professor Clifton Green says it just won't work.

“The idea is somehow if you avoid Exxon, and favor the other companies that would somehow force them to lower their prices to lure you back to them. Those places would run out of gas. It could actually make things worse in the short run instead of better,” Green said.

Instead, Green says there is really only one way that consumers can lower gas prices.

“The way to minimize the impact of gas on your life is to use less gas, to live closer to work, to use alternative transportation. It's just painful to make that happen, and that's what people are feeling right now,” Green said.

It comes down to supply and demand. If demand drops, supply goes up, and prices drop.

Professor Green’s advice is for consumers to change their relationship with gas. If they are not so dependent on it, the prices won’t be as upsetting.

http://www.11alive.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=79127

The Professor is correct. The only way to reduce petrol expenditures is to use less. If each individual took responsibility to cut back on their consumption of gasoline, we could make an impact.

I decided several years ago to redesign my life to be less reliant on autos and gasoline. At one point I was filling up my gas tank twice a week in order to commute to Silicon Valley. Now, I work in SF and use public transit. A tank of gas lasts me at least a month, often more. I realize that this dramatic of a reduction isn't possible for everyone - public transit is woefully inadequate. But carpooling and telecommuting can make an impact as well.

I still don't understand why people are saying that the gas companies are not responsible for the price of gas. If the gas companies listed minimal profits and we had gas prices a this level I could understand but its not. The barrel price has very little to do with the high price of gas. The fact that they could get away with the ability to price gouge us is why. In the last 6 months Exxon has recorded almost $19 billion in profits. (just read the article in class) $19 BILLION don't even tell me that the gas companies aren't responsible. As for boycotting, It won't work the companies have too much to float on and will end up hurting us in the end. What we need to do is appeal to the Goverment on all levels. We just had a talk in class about sending letters to the Vice president and one of the girls said what was the point her letter wouldn't change anything. My teacher responded with the statement that while your one letter may seem insignificant it is part of a much bigger thing. So appeal is what I say.

I still don't understand why people are saying that the gas companies are not responsible for the price of gas. If the gas companies listed minimal profits and we had gas prices a this level I could understand but its not. The barrel price has very little to do with the high price of gas. The fact that they could get away with the ability to price gouge us is why. In the last 6 months Exxon has recorded almost $19 billion in profits. (just read the article in class) $19 BILLION don't even tell me that the gas companies aren't responsible. As for boycotting, It won't work the companies have too much to float on and will end up hurting us in the end. What we need to do is appeal to the Goverment on all levels. We just had a talk in class about sending letters to the Vice president and one of the girls said what was the point her letter wouldn't change anything. My teacher responded with the statement that while your one letter may seem insignificant it is part of a much bigger thing. So appeal is what I say.

Tell your professor he's advocating for dictatorship.

19 billion? how does that compare to other 6-month periods? what's their profit margin? how does that compare to profits per gallon sold by competing firms?

that number is meaningless out of context. and your professor is using it as a basis for telling you to ask the government to take more control of your life.

I still don't understand why people are saying that the gas companies are not responsible for the price of gas. If the gas companies listed minimal profits and we had gas prices a this level I could understand but its not. The barrel price has very little to do with the high price of gas. The fact that they could get away with the ability to price gouge us is why. In the last 6 months Exxon has recorded almost $19 billion in profits. (just read the article in class) $19 BILLION don't even tell me that the gas companies aren't responsible. As for boycotting, It won't work the companies have too much to float on and will end up hurting us in the end. What we need to do is appeal to the Goverment on all levels. We just had a talk in class about sending letters to the Vice president and one of the girls said what was the point her letter wouldn't change anything. My teacher responded with the statement that while your one letter may seem insignificant it is part of a much bigger thing. So appeal is what I say.

^ Good deal. I'll call congress, the president, state reps, sign a petition, any and everything I can do to express my disapproval. I won't just sit here and take it.

I was watching c-span this morning and a caller called in and said that a guest was on their show talking about gas prices. The caller stated (speaking on behalf of whoever the guest was) that gas should realistically hit 3 dollars per gallon when oil is 95 dollars a barrel.

:rolleyes:

You're all just programmed to run to the government for help everytime something displeases you. It's a sad, sad state of affairs.

Thomas Jefferson would bitch slap you if he could.

:rolleyes:

You're all just programmed to run to the government for help everytime something displeases you. It's a sad, sad state of affairs.

Thomas Jefferson would bitch slap you if he could.

Advocating a boycott of Exxon Mobil is not what I would call running to the govt. But if "running to the gov't" works, run!

Feenix, would you be willing to pay 5 dollars per gallon for gas?

The economic realities of the universe will make your plan fail.

Second, EVEN IF you could get everyone to boycott Exxon/Mobil, that would just cause the other gas sellers to raise their prices in accordance with the higher demand they are experiencing. So ultimately you'd just be making a donation to Exxon/Mobil's compeditors. Then you'd probably get mad at them for posting record profits and you'd wanna boycott them, too.



In conjunction with that, Exxon-Mobil can continue selling their gas as 'unbranded', and the protestors buy it anyway....at the inflated prices their own boycott caused.

Feenix, would you be willing to pay 5 dollars per gallon for gas?

Nobody is happy that they have to pay $5 for a gallon of gas. What would you say is a fair price for gasoline?

I'm not happy that I have to pay $3.35 a gallon.

Most people want stuff to be free.

Just sayin'.

Nobody is happy that they have to pay $5 for a gallon of gas. What would you say is a fair price for gasoline?

I'm not happy that I have to pay $3.35 a gallon.

I'm not happy either (obviously). I was trying to find out from Feenix (who by the way hasn't made it back to this thread ) how much does he think is unreasonable. Maybe he is ok with 5 per gallon. Maybe not...

I was ok with gas being a 1.60. Of course that's relative to what I'm paying now (2.88-2.95.)

I'm not happy either (obviously). I was trying to find out from Feenix (who by the way hasn't made it back to this thread ) how much does he think is unreasonable. Maybe he is ok with 5 per gallon. Maybe not...

I was ok with gas being a 1.60. Of course that's relative to what I'm paying now (2.88-2.95.)
what is fair is what market forces dictate. if you don't want to pay that, fine. that's your right. find some other means to fill that need and tell all the oil companies to shove it.

"95% of gas stations in Michigan are locally owned. They aren’t big oil and they are struggling with these high costs too."

Just got that quote off my state's website.


http://www.mi.gov/som/0,1607,7-192--141415--,00.html

I'm not happy either (obviously). I was trying to find out from Feenix (who by the way hasn't made it back to this thread ) how much does he think is unreasonable. Maybe he is ok with 5 per gallon. Maybe not...

I was ok with gas being a 1.60. Of course that's relative to what I'm paying now (2.88-2.95.)

Adjusted for inflation, we're paying slightly less than we were in 1970. there's a graph floating around on the web somewhere that documents this. I'll post it, if I trip across it again.

Adjusted for inflation, we're paying slightly less than we were in 1970. there's a graph floating around on the web somewhere that documents this. I'll post it, if I trip across it again.

Thanks.

Does everything we pay for get adjusted for inflation (i.e. houses, cars, clothes, food, health insurance, automobile insurance)? Have wages/salaries been adjusted for inflation?

Thanks.

Does everything we pay for get adjusted for inflation (i.e. houses, cars, clothes, food, health insurance, automobile insurance)? Have wages/salaries been adjusted for inflation?

For most, if not all of that, probably yes. I'll post whatever graphs n' charts I happen across. Time, and interest permitting.

Does everything we pay for get adjusted for inflation (i.e. houses, cars, clothes, food, health insurance, automobile insurance)? Have wages/salaries been adjusted for inflation?
Yes. In fact we are at 130% from 1970, after inflation.

http://www.census.gov/prod/2005pubs/p60-229.pdf

Yes. In fact we are at 130% from 1970, after inflation.

http://www.census.gov/prod/2005pubs/p60-229.pdf

Well I don't recall rec'g a COLA in my salary once the price of oil and gas went up.

Too much in my opinion. Are you satisfied with the price of gasoline these days?


My satisfaction level with the price of gasoline does nothing to what it costs to produce that gasoline. All the outrage Congress can muster will do nothing to the cost. They can artificially force prices down for a while, but all that will do is ensure shortages.


That's all well and good. I just happen to believe that what I'm paying for gas is too much, and that I'm being overcharged. I also believe the oil companies are being overcompensated due to my being overcharged. And I don't think that I'm alone in believing this.


The oil companies are charging market prices. They build an enormous number of factors into that price. Believe me, if one company could consistently undercut the competition by 50 cents/gallon, it would do it in a heartbeat. The only way ALL the companies overcharge by the same amount is if they are colluding, and that's illegal. It has also been investigated every time the price of gas spikes up. It's never been found to have happened.


I guess it was a random pick of a major oil company. I don't know of any analytical explanation for it. I read an email about it.


I just think that if you're going to punish a company, picking the most successful is self-defeating. The less efficient ones should feel the heat.


What?


Haven't you ever considered the replacement cost of oil? A company has to replace every barrel it uses, and if the price to replace is more than the money it made from the last, the company will quickly run out of money.


I resent the high price of gasoline. You defend the oil companies better than they defend themselves (NBC reported that the oil execs are having a hard time returning their calls). Are you failing to comprehend that we pay more so that they take more? Oil or gasoline can't be purchased like a pair of shoes where you shop according to how much you want to spend.


That's because there's a wide variety of shoes. Different quality, name brands, and many other factors mean you can spend more or less. Oil and gasoline are commodities, and a gallon from one company is not very different from another.


Furthermore, please express to me how you feel about the businesses and working families that are now being adversely affected by these high gas and oil prices. What about the gas station owners I heard about on Fox news that aren't selling any gas in protest of the high prices. Are you just as concerned about them too? Or is your concern just for the oil companies that basically charge you what they damn well please?

If a station voluntarily stops selling gasoline, who are they hurting? They are hurting themselves and the people who depend on the gasoline they refuse to sell. They're being selfish. They're NOT going to hurt the oil company.

Where are all the greens who were advocating higher gas taxes just a few years ago? Shouldn't they be absolutely delighted at the higher prices we're all paying? Or is the problem that the money isn't going to the government? I would like someone who has access to Al Gore and John Kerry to ask them if they're happy that we're finally paying the prices they wanted us to pay.

Feenix, would you be willing to pay 5 dollars per gallon for gas?

That's irrelevent.

The solutions you're proposing would not do anything to lower the price of gas.

Are you satisfied paying $1800 for a new computer? If you boycotted Dell just because Dell is the biggest PC manufacturer, and still bought a Compaq, do you think the price of computers would go down?

That's irrelevent.

The solutions you're proposing would not do anything to lower the price of gas.

Are you satisfied paying $1800 for a new computer? If you boycotted Dell just because Dell is the biggest PC manufacturer, and still bought a Compaq, do you think the price of computers would go down?

Jeez! It's just a question: Would you be willing to pay $5 for gasoline? You can answer, or don't answer if you don't want to.

Where are all the greens who were advocating higher gas taxes just a few years ago? Shouldn't they be absolutely delighted at the higher prices we're all paying? Or is the problem that the money isn't going to the government? I would like someone who has access to Al Gore and John Kerry to ask them if they're happy that we're finally paying the prices they wanted us to pay.

True but a few years ago gas wasn't even 2 dollars a gallon(if I am not mistaken). Correct me if I'm wrong but taxes are not made to deliberately hyper inflate prices. The objective of the tax never was to cause us to pay massive amounts of money for gas. This feels highly irrelevant to the fact of high gas prices.

True but a few years ago gas wasn't even 2 dollars a gallon(if I am not mistaken). Correct me if I'm wrong but taxes are not made to deliberately hyper inflate prices. The objective of the tax never was to cause us to pay massive amounts of money for gas. This feels highly irrelevant to the fact of high gas prices.

John Kerry - http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/editorials/articles/2004/03/28/the_high_cost_of_cheap_gas?mode=PF
In his defense, he did realize it was a bad idea, but it goes to show how disconnected Washington is.


Al Gore - "Higher taxes on fossil fuels. . . is one of the logical first steps in changing our policies in a manner consistent with a more responsible approach to the environment." (Al Gore, Earth in the Balance, 1993, p. 173)


Other politicians have done the same thing, advocated for higher taxes, then fell silent or complained when prices naturally rose to levels they themselves had proposed. I guess they don't like someone other than the government getting the money.

Again, stop whining, gas is $7 per gallon in Norway and we get by fine :p

My satisfaction level with the price of gasoline does nothing to what it costs to produce that gasoline...

You said a mouthful, but you didn't answer the question. I would very much like for you to answer the question.

The oil companies are charging market prices...

The oil companies are making record profits, and the people in the market are unhappy because they feel the "market price" is too high. Why is this the case?

They build an enormous number of factors into that price. Believe me, if one company could consistently undercut the competition by 50 cents/gallon, it would do it in a heartbeat. The only way ALL the companies overcharge by the same amount is if they are colluding, and that's illegal. It has also been investigated every time the price of gas spikes up. It's never been found to have happened.

ummm....ok



I just think that if you're going to punish a company, picking the most successful is self-defeating. The less efficient ones should feel the heat.

The company that was picked is successful and efficient at overcharging for gasoline - for starts. I think the pick was a good one.

Haven't you ever considered the replacement cost of oil? A company has to replace every barrel it uses, and if the price to replace is more than the money it made from the last, the company will quickly run out of money.

Please. Don't try and sound like all along you've known exactly what you've been talking about. You have already made several questionable statements in my opinion.

That's because there's a wide variety of shoes. Different quality, name brands, and many other factors mean you can spend more or less. Oil and gasoline are commodities, and a gallon from one company is not very different from another.

Thanks, my point exactly. Gasoline is pretty much a uniform cost. Shoes aren't, and the differences between the 2 are obvious as it relates to price variance.

So do you think it's possible that gas just may be overpriced, especially when you consider the number of oil companies who have amassed record breaking profits?

If a station voluntarily stops selling gasoline, who are they hurting? They are hurting themselves and the people who depend on the gasoline they refuse to sell. They're being selfish. They're NOT going to hurt the oil company.

They're protesting. The point was to show that even gas station owners are at odds with the prices at the pump. Consider this: 95% of gas stations in Michigan are locally owned. They aren’t big oil and they are struggling with these high costs too (source: http://www.mi.gov/som/0,1607,7-192--141415--,00.html) So the next time you here the contention that gas station owners are just as guilty as the oil companies for these inflated prices, you will also know that there are exceptions.

And maybe the gas station owners who are protesting do have more to lose than myself by protesting, because not buying any products from Exxon Mobil won't be a burden on me at all. So at the same time that they're hurting themselves, the gas station owners who are protesting are also showing you and I how bad it actually is.

Betrade, I have 2 questions for you. Is there any cost for gasoline that you think would be unreasonable? If so, what would that price be?

I don't like the current prices at all, but you need to direct your question to the traders and investors who are willing to pay these high prices per barrell, and the cartels who control production, and hold back reserves.

This country has set itself up for this over the past thirty years. There has been no real energy policy, and the environmentalists fight tooth and nail at any attempt for us to increase our refining capacity and drill our own wells here at home. We're now reaping what we've sown, and what we've failed to sow.

It's not the fault of the current administration, but the fault of the last thirty years of bad policy by all administrations and Congress. They have allowed a virtual monopoly to exist that controls a vital international commodity.

You said a mouthful, but you didn't answer the question. I would very much like for you to answer the question.


Okay. I don't like paying high prices for gasoline. I also don't like paying high prices for laser eye surgery and for BMW's, but that's life. The real question is, what IS the proper price for a gallon of gasoline? Consumers want it low, producers want it high. There are several factors that go into setting the price of gasoline. There is the "terror premium", which adds about $10-$15/bbl of oil, there is the summer driving season, which always bumps the price up, there is the lack of refinery capacity (we haven't built any new ones in decades, so we can't handle any increase in demand), the recovery from hurricane Katrina hasn't been completed yet, and the EPA mandates all sorts of gasoline reformulations at this time of year. All these things conspire to drive up prices. The fact that all the gas stations charge about the same price tells me that is about the "right" price. Oh, and the government snags a big chunk of every gallon. Want to lower the price at the pump? The government could do it very simply by just dropping the gas tax.


The oil companies are making record profits, and the people in the market are unhappy because they feel the "market price" is too high. Why is this the case?


Because consumers are accustomed to paying relatively little for gasoline. I feel that the price of a BMW is too high. Why is that the case?


The company that was picked is successful and efficient at overcharging for gasoline - for starts. I think the pick was a good one.


They are all charging about the same amount, so that's not a real good reason.


Please. Don't try and sound like all along you've known exactly what you've been talking about. You have already made several questionable statements in my opinion.


Aside from that being an unwarranted personal attack, what exactly do you think I have said that is questionable?


Thanks, my point exactly. Gasoline is pretty much a uniform cost. Shoes aren't, and the differences between the 2 are obvious as it relates to price variance.


I don't see Exxon Mobil charging more than anyone else. In fact, I see them charging LESS.


So do you think it's possible that gas just may be overpriced, especially when you consider the number of oil companies who have amassed record breaking profits?


I've already addressed that. They may be making record profits now, but they could evaporate tomorrow, when the replacement cost of oil erodes it away. Do you not expect the price to ANTICIPATE future cost increases? If they didn't do that, they would go out of business. The only way the price is artificially high is if they collude, and that's illegal.


They're protesting. The point was to show that even gas station owners are at odds with the prices at the pump. Consider this: 95% of gas stations in Michigan are locally owned. They aren’t big oil and they are struggling with these high costs too (source: http://www.mi.gov/som/0,1607,7-192--141415--,00.html) So the next time you here the contention that gas station owners are just as guilty as the oil companies for these inflated prices, you will also know that there are exceptions.


If they're upset about the price at the pump, why don't they just charge less? Isn't that what you want Congress to force oil companies to do?


And maybe the gas station owners who are protesting do have more to lose than myself by protesting, because not buying any products from Exxon Mobil won't be a burden on me at all. So at the same time that they're hurting themselves, the gas station owners who are protesting are also showing you and I how bad it actually is.

They are also hurting anyone who wants to buy gas from them. Here's a thought. Maybe all the gas stations should boycott their suppliers until the price comes down. Then they could all go out of business together and no one could get gas.

:rolleyes:

You're all just programmed to run to the government for help everytime something displeases you. It's a sad, sad state of affairs.

Thomas Jefferson would bitch slap you if he could.


Jefferson was for monopolies that have the power to cause a reccession??

:rolleyes:

The oil companies have declared war on the American people, the governments main role is to provide for our defense.

Gas is a necessity, I guess you don't care if people are starving, the economy is in ruins, and crime is rampant, as long as white colar criminals can heat their homes with wads of thousand dollar bills you're happy.

:nonono: :nonono:

Again, stop whining, gas is $7 per gallon in Norway and we get by fine :p


We have no mass transit and our cities are HUGE.

We need our cars, gas is a necessity, like electricity, look what happened here in Ca when Enron jacked the price up 2000%.

I love it how some people say we should just stop buying gas if we don't like the prices, what kind of crack are they smoking?

Okay. I don't like paying high prices for gasoline. I also don't like paying high prices for laser eye surgery and for BMW's, but that's life. The real question is, what IS the proper price for a gallon of gasoline? Consumers want it low, producers want it high. There are several factors that go into setting the price of gasoline. There is the "terror premium", which adds about $10-$15/bbl of oil, there is the summer driving season, which always bumps the price up, there is the lack of refinery capacity (we haven't built any new ones in decades, so we can't handle any increase in demand), the recovery from hurricane Katrina hasn't been completed yet, and the EPA mandates all sorts of gasoline reformulations at this time of year. All these things conspire to drive up prices. The fact that all the gas stations charge about the same price tells me that is about the "right" price. Oh, and the government snags a big chunk of every gallon. Want to lower the price at the pump? The government could do it very simply by just dropping the gas tax.



Because consumers are accustomed to paying relatively little for gasoline. I feel that the price of a BMW is too high. Why is that the case?



They are all charging about the same amount, so that's not a real good reason.



Aside from that being an unwarranted personal attack, what exactly do you think I have said that is questionable?



I don't see Exxon Mobil charging more than anyone else. In fact, I see them charging LESS.



I've already addressed that. They may be making record profits now, but they could evaporate tomorrow, when the replacement cost of oil erodes it away. Do you not expect the price to ANTICIPATE future cost increases? If they didn't do that, they would go out of business. The only way the price is artificially high is if they collude, and that's illegal.



If they're upset about the price at the pump, why don't they just charge less? Isn't that what you want Congress to force oil companies to do?



They are also hurting anyone who wants to buy gas from them. Here's a thought. Maybe all the gas stations should boycott their suppliers until the price comes down. Then they could all go out of business together and no one could get gas.



The very fact that you can't tell the difference between luxury items like a BMW and a necessity shows how out of touch you far right wingers are.

I'm convinced you guys will destroy this country with your lack of critical thuoght and foresight, you guys wanted us to trust you with things like Iraq, don't expect people to get burned again by this pr.

Here's a thought: develop a strategy to develop a career and a lifestyle that enables you to reduce your dependence on auto-transport by moving to a place with mass transit alternatives or which enables you to commute by walking or biking?

It will take time - but if you are that torqued about gas prices, then why not try it?

Here's a thought: develop a strategy to develop a career and a lifestyle that enables you to reduce your dependence on auto-transport by moving to a place with mass transit alternatives or which enables you to commute by walking or biking?

It will take time - but if you are that torqued about gas prices, then why not try it?


Good Lord... Let's all move to Paris, they have great public transportation!!


:rolleyes:

Well, CA is tacitly admitting that he is incapable of doing something which I have successfully accomplished - Here In The Good Ol' U.S. Of A.!

Now if he would just GROK the rest of his erroneous worldview.

Well, CA is tacitly admitting that he is incapable of doing something which I have successfully accomplished - Here In The Good Ol' U.S. Of A.!

Now if he would just GROK the rest of his erroneous worldview.


You are suggesting that if a large criminal enterprise is making life tough in any given country, instead of going after the criminal enterprise and raising the quality of life, everybody should flee, flee their lives, their family, and their friends.

Why in the hell should I have to move and have a freedom removed from me so that companies like ExxonMobil can keep gouging the nation?

If there's a sudden onslaught of crime in your neighborhood, should you just pack up and move, or should the police go and apprehend the criminals?


It's funny, when certain liberals said they would move out of the country if Bush was elected the right went crazy, calling them cowards, traitors, amd all sorts of nasty things. Yet it's exactly what you are advocating, you advocate people cut and run instead of face the problem.

I'm saying that if one is unhappy about an aspect of one's life that is larglely beyond one's control (oil prices are going to stay high due to demand from China, India and the rest of the developing world) - and, if one is RATIONAL, one would make modifications to one's circumstances so as to minimize the impact of said unhappiness inducing aspect.

I'm saying that if one is unhappy about an aspect of one's life that is larglely beyond one's control (oil prices are going to stay high due to demand from China, India and the rest of the developing world) - and, if one is RATIONAL, one would make modifications to one's circumstances so as to minimize the impact of said unhappiness inducing aspect.


I wouldn't care if I was the richest man on Earth, the whole point is what they are doing is wrong, I really do care about all the poor people who are forced to put gas in their tanks over food in their stomachs, hearing those stories makes me mad as all hell.

People are being robbed right now, future plans years from now aren't going to do anything to alleviate the current situation, that's the whole problem.

And it is a total fallacy that the gas prices here are because of high demand overseas. There are no shortages at all. The oil companies and the refiners collude to keep prices artificially high, that's well known, which is why they never build anymore refineries and whythey've bought up and shut down most of the independents. No competition = they can jack the prices up as high as they want, where do we draw the line? The oil cartels are raking in profits by the billions at the expense of the good of the nation. They are recieving billions in tax cuts at the same time, which you and I ultimately pay for. They become filthy rich off of their service, their service is a vital necessity to the nation, they can't just charge whatever they wish for gas. What if everybody's electricity bill suddenly went up to 5000 dollars a month? Would you just shrug your shoulders and say "that's their right to make a profit in the free market"??

The very fact that you can't tell the difference between luxury items like a BMW and a necessity shows how out of touch you far right wingers are.

I'm convinced you guys will destroy this country with your lack of critical thuoght and foresight, you guys wanted us to trust you with things like Iraq, don't expect people to get burned again by this pr.

You apparently don't understand supply and demand very well. The fact that you label me a far right winger tells me you don't apply critical thinking very well. The fact that you think I'm somehow responsible for Congress okaying the war in Iraq tells me you don't even do hindsight very well. You don't like the BMW comparison? Fine, I think all cars cost too much. I shouldn't be saddled with a monthly payment of several hundred dollars just to get myself around. The government needs to step in right now and force big auto and all those greedy unions to stop charging me so much just to buy a car. I need a car, it's a necessity, and I shouldn't have to pay full price for it. Is that better? If somebody owes you cheap gas, don't they owe me a cheap, high-quality car?

Here's a thought: develop a strategy to develop a career and a lifestyle that enables you to reduce your dependence on auto-transport by moving to a place with mass transit alternatives or which enables you to commute by walking or biking?

It will take time - but if you are that torqued about gas prices, then why not try it?

Don't you just hate it when you take steps to make your situation more tolerable for yourself and a bunch of other people start complaining because they won't? The point is, you saw a stress on your life and made the effort to alleviate it without requiring the American taxpayer to pay for it. Bravo.

IAnd it is a total fallacy that the gas prices here are because of high demand overseas. There are no shortages at all. The oil companies and the refiners collude to keep prices artificially high, that's well known,
A little proof of this would be nice. An indictment or two would do.

which is why they never build anymore refineries and whythey've bought up and shut down most of the independents.You don't suppose the fierce opposition by eco-nuts to any new refineries being built anywhere has something to do with it, do you? No competition = they can jack the prices up as high as they want, where do we draw the line?You don't suppose the high cost of entry into the oil business is keeping out competition, do you? The oil cartels are raking in profits by the billions at the expense of the good of the nation.OPEC certainly is They are recieving billions in tax cuts at the same time, which you and I ultimately pay for.Actually, we pay for all the taxes they pay. A tax cut is money we don't have to pay. They become filthy rich off of their service, their service is a vital necessity to the nation, they can't just charge whatever they wish for gas.They've only been making big money the last few years. It wasn't long ago that they were laying people off and capping wells because they couldn't afford to keep them open. It's a cycle, and they'll have down turns again. What if everybody's electricity bill suddenly went up to 5000 dollars a month? Would you just shrug your shoulders and say "that's their right to make a profit in the free market"??

It depends on why the bill went up. If there were perfectly good reasons, like several major power plants being blown up by eco-nuts, or the power grid being knocked out by an EMP, I would be mad, but wouldn't blame the power companies. Now, if there weren't any good reasons, I'd buy a generator.

EDIT - Forget good reasons. If my electric bill went to $5,000/month, I'd buy a generator no matter what.

Don't you just hate it when you take steps to make your situation more tolerable for yourself and a bunch of other people start complaining because they won't? The point is, you saw a stress on your life and made the effort to alleviate it without requiring the American taxpayer to pay for it. Bravo.


I don't hate it - I am rather bemused.

It is very telling to observe those actually are willing to accept responsibility for their choices and those just want to sit around and whinge.

Don't you just hate it when you take steps to make your situation more tolerable for yourself and a bunch of other people start complaining because they won't? The point is, you saw a stress on your life and made the effort to alleviate it without requiring the American taxpayer to pay for it. Bravo.I agree. Now watch as liberals convince government to steal from boe so they don't have to suffer their own lack of responsibility.

It is very telling to observe those actually are willing to accept responsibility for their choices and those just want to sit around and whinge.
:nice:

In this ever more interconnected and complex society, it can be difficult to accept responsibility for ones own actions. These difficulties are both literal and emotional, as I cannot eliminate fossil fuels from my consumption unless i become a mountain man, while others have trouble controling their excessive consumtion patterns.

I don't like the current prices at all, but you need to direct your question to the traders and investors who are willing to pay these high prices per barrell, ...

Betrade, I would like you to answer the question. The questions were: Is there any cost for gasoline that you think would be unreasonable? If so, what would that price be?

This country has set itself up for this over the past thirty years. There has been no real energy policy, and the environmentalists fight tooth and nail at any attempt for us to increase our refining capacity and drill our own wells here at home. We're now reaping what we've sown, and what we've failed to sow.

I see. But in the meantime gas is $3. What do we do now?

It's not the fault of the current administration, but the fault of the last thirty years of bad policy by all administrations and Congress. They have allowed a virtual monopoly to exist that controls a vital international commodity.

Well, I read the the price of oil (or was it gas) increased 240 percent since Pres. Bush assumed the presidency. I also read the oil companies contributed 9x more to Bush's campaing than Kerry's. And no, I'm not blaming Bush for these high gas prices, but still...

We have no mass transit and our cities are HUGE.- Good point, but that's an argument for better mass transit, not necessarily for cheaper gas. In fact, taxing gas can some times be a good way of supporting a mass transit system.

Betrade, I would like you to answer the question. The questions were: Is there any cost for gasoline that you think would be unreasonable? If so, what would that price be?



I see. But in the meantime gas is $3. What do we do now?



Well, I read the the price of oil (or was it gas) increased 240 percent since Pres. Bush assumed the presidency. I also read the oil companies contributed 9x more to Bush's campaing than Kerry's. And no, I'm not blaming Bush for these high gas prices, but still...


Again, I am not the person whodetermines oil prices, and I don't like the current prices. What difference does it make what I think is "reasonable" anyway? It won't change a thing. I remember when gas was 50 cents a gallon, and people bitched when it when up to 75. Everything is relative.

As for the administration, lots of things have happend since Bush became president, and I could just as easily say that gas has gone up since that lunatic became President in Iran. Everything that happens can't be blamed on one person or event most of the time.

We're talking about a commodity that's traded on the open, international market. Those who do the trading will determine what the "right" price is based on numerous factors.