I know there is a difference, but I think sometimes it is close to tell. My question is, which one are you attracted to? Both? Neither? I like girls who don’t bash themselves all the time, but think that you are not worthy to talk to them. And what is the difference anyhow?


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Success is getting what you want.
Happiness is wanting what you get.

Confidence is saying "I know I COULD be the shiz." Conceitedness is saying "I AM the shiz..."

See the difference? http://discussanything.com/Ubb/wink.gif

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

I see confidence more like "I know I got what it takes to be the shiz"

but in a way, that may be concietedness (sp)

Those two qualities are too intertwined to seperate clearly.

IF you know you're good at something, then you know you can succeed to a certain level. If you're REALLY good at something, then you probably believe you could do more . . . but you don't know . . . but you "know". Is that confidence or . . .??

Eh, it's a soft subject, but I think to have one you HAVE to have a bit of the other.

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

it's a fine line, my friend...

Digging the quote, by the way...

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

[This message has been edited by Demeter (edited 10-25-2001).]

your right, a very fine line..

I got into a discussion / arguement with a girl about it.. she likes confidence, but not the concietedness.. but couldn't really give me a distinction between the two

Dont listen to women, no logic when it comes to relationships. They say they want a nice guy, and want a badass. They say they want a simple poet, but pick a rich spoiled bastard. Just remember, they say shit to improve their image, not to inform you.

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Blind faith can lead one to the light, or plung them into eternal darkness.

CT . . . on THAT we can agree.

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

I know this has been said, but think about it..

they won't tell you anything they don't want you to know..

I mean, they ain't going to share their secrets with us.. no matter how much we think they might..

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Success is getting what you want.
Happiness is wanting what you get.

Hehehehe . . . the TRUTH:

NO ONE is in control for long. It's like straddling a seesaw. Things work best if you make small adjustments either way and often. If you make a drastic move one way or the other, odds are you're going to crash.

There's nothing wrong with either partner being dominant as long as the other partner is happy with the direction. HOWEVER, both need to roar now and again and demand capitulance on some minor issue.

And remember this EVERYONE . . . you can RULE a relationship, but the tighter you grip, the more easy rebellion is to get started. And it only takes ONE other more friendly "leader" to steal away your kingdom.

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

Durden- dam right.

Demeter- you do not need to be mysterious, you may want someone mysterious though. Guys can like a simple woman. In fact, I prefer a girl who shows what she really is, less crap to deal with.

Oh, and the girls secret handshake... I'll open my pants, and you shake it. http://discussanything.com/Ubb/tongue.gif

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Blind faith can lead one to the light, or plung them into eternal darkness.

FOr what it's worth (and to get back onto the original track http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif ), my view of confidence vs conceitedness is that confidence is simply believing in yourself and being pround of your achievements. Conceitedness is when you go beyond that and start thinking you, your opinion and achievements count for more than anyone elses. When you start looking down on everyone else, then it's conceit.

That's my two cents http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif I'm not dumb enough to get drawn into a men vs women debate otherwise - ROFLMAO! http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif

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'The roots of true achievement lie in the will to become the best that you can become' Harold Taylor

'Accept the challenges so that you may feel the exhileration of victory' General George S Patton

"There is no weapon deadlier than the will" Bruce Lee

http://www.boortz.com/gadsden.gif

Darlings, if we shared them with you, they wouldn't be secrets, and if we didn't have secrets we wouldn't be "mysterious", and if we weren't mysterious and acted like we GAVE a damn, you wouldn't want us.

And that would be just silly...

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

God forbid females to be simple.. http://discussanything.com/Ubb/smile.gif

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Success is getting what you want.
Happiness is wanting what you get.

Being complicated is what keeps us going...and you, for that matter. You guys would get SO bored with us if we were "simple"...takes all the adventure out of the thing.

It's the JOURNEY, not the DESTINATION...

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

very true.. I would rather figure a girl out then have her wait on hand and foot for me.. I guess it's just the challenge that gets us guys going..

ahh.. crap.. that's our secret http://discussanything.com/Ubb/smile.gif

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Success is getting what you want.
Happiness is wanting what you get.

Muhhaaaahhhaaa!!! I have the power! I know the secret!! Quick, where's my cape and crown???

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

maybe we just want you to think that's our secret..


(*ok guys new secret needed*)

Nah, the real "secret" of love is that we let you THINK you are in control...it's in the Girl's Handbook...right next to the secret handshake...

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

you guys have a secret handshake too?? : )

as long as you don't figure out our secret knock, you won't be able to get in our treehouse..

Originally posted by Demeter:
Muhhaaaahhhaaa!!! I have the power! I know the secret!! Quick, where's my cape and crown???




Hey..You cant have my cape and crown... What are you thinking... ???? http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif


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"The grand essentials to happiness in this life are something to do, something to love, and something to hope for"
-Joseph Addison

If woman were more straight up it would leave less time for arguements and more time for...



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Manu Narayan

Yeah, but men have to be more at ease with talking about what THEY want, too. I mean, men are really bad about capitulation until they can't stand it, anymore . . . and then exploding.

Instead of holding things in, let your woman KNOW how you feel . . . even when you're not sure yourself. Talk it out a bit.

And women, cut it out with the games and the reading too much into things. Stop that "well, he wore his blue shirt today . . . and that's his favorite, which means he's trying to impress someone . . . and maybe even fool around on me . . . so, if I call him at 11:00 today and ask him for lunch and he DOESN'T make time for me, then he's been cheating on me for months and the relationship is over . . . and I'm leaving".

In reality, the blue shirt was on top of the basket . . .

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

Yeah, but don't forget about that games crap ladies . . . and many of you DO play games.

Oh, and another thing . . . when you set out to CHANGE a man into what you want, please be so kind not to CHANGE YOUR MIND once you get us trained. And, if you DO practice that, kindly not BITCH AND MOAN to everyone about your man when he refuses to change. Take it as a compliment. He's only trying to hold onto you (for some idiotic reason . . . maybe it's because you're double jointed or something . . . or have no gag reflex . . . who knows?).

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

Ok, I'm sick and tired of the bad rap that SO many women get because of the actions of a few of us. You guys are always whining and bitching that we go for the "bad" boys, the wife beaters and the drunks, all the while conviently forgetting that some of you, probably the same ones that are whining, go for the playas and golddiggers of the female species. Your judgement is just as questionable as ours is. And when you DO get the "good" girl, the one who KNOWS what being a real woman is really all about, you ASSUME that she is doing nothing but playing mind games and sharpening her sacraficial knife behind your back.

As far as changing our minds, has it ever occured to you that maybe we aren't fickle, but simply ADJUSTING to and dealing with the curve balls that both you and life throw at us? Don't hold on to us because of the double jointedness and the fabulous way we have of making you feel as though yours is the biggest and the best. Hold on to us because we're the fantastic creatures you've always wanted. We're not all picturing your family jewels on our trophy room walls. The sex is much better with all the equipment in it's place.

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

[This message has been edited by Demeter (edited 10-30-2001).]

Originally posted by Demeter:
Ok, I'm sick and tired of the bad rap that SO many women get because of the actions of a few of us...you ASSUME that she is doing nothing but playing mind games and sharpening her sacraficial knife behind your back...We're not all picturing your family jewels on our trophy room walls.

No, not every woman is a golddigging, backstabbing bitch. But, most men are open about what we are and what we want. Women can be a bit manipulative, and when one woman is a bitch, other women defend her.

If a guy is an *******, I will not defend him. But for some reason, women can be so insecure, they will not only defend themselves, but their entire gender. You should realize that as many men are dogs, as women are bitches.

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Blind faith can lead one to the light, or plung them into eternal darkness.

Originally posted by D Durden:
Oh, and another thing . . . when you set out to CHANGE a man into what you want, please be so kind not to CHANGE YOUR MIND once you get us trained.

I have noticed and heard that men marry women for what they are when they meet them. Women marry men for their potential. For better or worse, women tend to mold or change men to be more successful. And most men want their women to stay as they were when they where young and trim.

Both sides have a positive and negitive to their approch.

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Blind faith can lead one to the light, or plung them into eternal darkness.

Originally posted by Demeter:
Ok, I'm sick and tired of the bad rap that SO many women get because of the actions of a few of us. You guys are always whining and bitching that we go for the "bad" boys, the wife beaters and the drunks, all the while conviently forgetting that some of you, probably the same ones that are whining, go for the playas and golddiggers of the female species.
What's your point? http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif If you haven't notice, generally, THOSE are the ones with the short skirts, high heels, and big, beautiful . . . eyes. It's like fishing . . . the guy with the most attractive bait gets the bite . . . so to speak! http://discussanything.com/Ubb/wink.gif We're pigs, remember?

Your judgement is just as questionable as ours is. And when you DO get the "good" girl, the one who KNOWS what being a real woman is really all about, you ASSUME that she is doing nothing but playing mind games and sharpening her sacraficial knife behind your back.

It's called 'past experience', and that bitch is a very passionate teacher. Generally, I get uneasy feelings about ANY attractive woman who's nice to me. She generally either wants something or is too nice to tell me she's not interested. It's much more humane to lead me on and embarass me in public http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif. Anyway, most of us DON'T find a real woman under the age of 27 so the argument is fairly moot.

As far as changing our minds, has it ever occured to you that maybe we aren't fickle, but simply ADJUSTING to and dealing with the curve balls that both you and life throw at us? Don't hold on to us because of the double jointedness and the fabulous way we have of making you feel as though yours is the biggest and the best.

Okay, first of all, how many of us know some girl that clung to a loser in hopes of "changing" him? Okay, put your hands down. Now, how many of those girls dumped him on his ass the MINUTE he changed and picked up some other guy in need of changing. Okay, put your hands back down! LOL!

Most younger women ARE fickle . . . or at least inexperienced. They lack the experience to REALLY tell what they want in a long term partner. It's like buying a car. Sure, the Porsches are nice, but not when you're 32 and have a kid or two. Granted, that loner-rebel-broody musician is exciting and all, but, uh, he's not going to be a long term fixture to build a life around (no offense to you musicians . . . heck, I'm dating a singer, myself!).

The problem we as men have is that women often times want extremes in treatment. One minute they want Roger Moore in a tux and the next they want Max Hardcore with a whip, a doggie biscuit, and a pair of earmuffs (and, anyone here who KNOWS who Max Hardcore is, I'm ASHAMED OF YOU!). Men have a big enough problem dealing with simple things like love and fidelity without having to have to guess whether little Suzi needs a flower, a gun, or a rough roll in the hay.

Women need to remember that we CAN'T read their minds, we DON'T over analyze the situation, and, for God's sake, if you say you don't want to go to the football game, we figure you DON'T WANT TO GO TO THE FOOTBALL GAME. We didn't not interpolate that to mean that we're not spending enough time at home with you, we haven't been on a DATE in 2 weeks, and you really need to be held right now because your boss at work is being especially hard on you. Sorry! http://discussanything.com/Ubb/wink.gif

Ladies, believe me, I sympathize in dealing with us apes, but we're REALLY simple creatures. Find a guy who's COMPLETELY open about what he wants. Find out what it is. If you fit, odds are, you're going to keep him forever. If the guy lies to you or is unsure himself, uhhhhh . . . run!

Believe it or not girls, men WANT relationships. We just don't want a psycho or a wet blanket. Unless you're some stud, hunting up a female companion is a BIG PAIN IN THE ASS. You generally have to fight through the baggage of the last 3 losers she's allowed to trample her OR, even worse, you have to overcome her "yeah, I'm a bitch and you can get over it" attitude (I find dumping a drink in her lap in public and screaming "for the hundredth time, I don't care how much you like it, I'm NOT peeing on you again!" . . . and leaving . . . but hey, that's just me).

Then, on that RARE chance you get a nice girl, you've got to HOPE that she fits the things that you need AND neither one of you have an interpersonal fatal flaw with the other (smoking, farting, had slept with your sister . . . AND father!). IF you get past that, AND no one gets cold feet . . . blah, blah, blah . . .

ANYWAY, ladies, from a man who's loved, lost, kicked the bitch out, and found REAL love again, let me assure you that we ARE looking for a relationship. We're NOT looking to be out on the street looking again. Granted, we NEVER stop looking, but we DO like to retire are recruiters . . . if you know what I mean.

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

Originally posted by ChaoticThoughts:
I have noticed and heard that men marry women for what they are when they meet them. Women marry men for their potential. For better or worse, women tend to mold or change men to be more successful. And most men want their women to stay as they were when they where young and trim.

Both sides have a positive and negitive to their approch.



Honestly, I don't know about "better", but I'd say more of what the woman PERCEIVES as better. Now, if "better" is more loving, caring, ambitious, and moral, all the better. However, if it is more selfish, money-hungry, and more submissive to her desiers . . . welllllllll . . .

Men and women want the same thing IN GENERAL. The difference is in how we both go about acheiving it.

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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."

Instead of holding things in, let your woman KNOW how you feel . . . even when you're not sure yourself. Talk it out a bit.
[/B]

Durden for PRESIDENT!!! Thank you! It's about time!

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"It's 106 miles to Chicago, we've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.Hit it."

Originally posted by D Durden:
Honestly, I don't know about "better", but I'd say more of what the woman PERCEIVES as better. Now, if "better" is more loving, caring, ambitious, and moral, all the better. However, if it is more selfish, money-hungry, and more submissive to her desiers . . . welllllllll . . .

Men and women want the same thing IN GENERAL. The difference is in how we both go about acheiving it.

What are you talking about? I didn't even use the word better... enough cough syrup for you.

And I dont think everyone is looking for the same thing. But if you can find someone that is looking for the same thing as you, you hit the jackpot.

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Blind faith can lead one to the light, or plung them into eternal darkness.

Originally posted by ChaoticThoughts:
What are you talking about? I didn't even use the word better... enough cough syrup for you.

And I dont think everyone is looking for the same thing. But if you can find someone that is looking for the same thing as you, you hit the jackpot.




I am with you on this one. Not everyone wants the same thing..Trust me I have met far to many that wants exactly opposite then what the hell I want. You learn that real quick in life. I guess each failure brings you one closer to the one you are compatible with.. and if NOT I suppose you Settle http://discussanything.com/Ubb/wink.gif


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"The grand essentials to happiness in this life are something to do, something to love, and something to hope for"
-Joseph Addison

Originally posted by ChaoticThoughts:
What are you talking about? I didn't even use the word better... enough cough syrup for you.

And I dont think everyone is looking for the same thing. But if you can find someone that is looking for the same thing as you, you hit the jackpot.




See the word "better" up there in YOUR quotes????? Now pass that bottle! http://discussanything.com/Ubb/wink.gif

I think what you'll find a VAST majority of the time is that women will tell you they want this when they really want something vastly different. I'm simplistic terms, you'd be likely to hear this from a girl:

"Hi everyone! I'm looking for an Aryan, Anti-sematic American Indian to marry and have a life with . . . now, meet my boyfriend of 8 years, Mr. Bucky Goldstein."

http://discussanything.com/Ubb/biggrin.gif


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Minister of Spanking

"I AM the lyrical Jesse James."