As most students of Nazi Germany would know, June 1934 was the era known as the "Night of the Long Knives". It was at this time that Hitler, acting on the urging of Himmler, Goering and the German Army leaders arested and killed two hundred or so Stormtroopers as a means to destroy their power and thwart a possible revolution. It should be noted that the SA was the left wing of the German Nazi Party. They were strongly anti-capitalist and detested the German aristocracy with as much venom as they did other enemies of the Nazis.

While it was never proved that an actual conspiracy existed for the SA to grab power, they certainly had the means to do it. The SA consisted of 400,000 German men. Many of these were war veterans and experienced in the art of urban warfare from earlier scraps with Communists and other insurgents as members of the Freikorps. In short, the SA was a force to be reconed with.

While the brownshirts were no angels, they were anti-semetic brutes who contained a fair number of gangsters and petty criminals, it could be also said that their leader, Ernst Rohm was at least a man who believed in social justice and equality. It is indeed probable that would Rohm had seized power than perhaps the Nazis, though brutal would have been less intent on conquest and destruction.

One irony, many of the same Generals who urged Hitler to destroy the SA later tried to seize power in the "General's plot" and paid with their lives.

While the brownshirts were no angels, they were anti-semetic brutes who contained a fair number of gangsters and petty criminals, it could be also said that their leader, Ernst Rohm was at least a man who believed in social justice and equality.


LOL Ernst Roehm was the biggest gangster and criminal of the entire SA! They used to call him "Machine Gun" Roehm.

And how does an Anti-Semite believe in social justice and equality?

Can we have just one thread on DA about NS Germany without anti-Semitism becoming part of the discussion?

Originally posted by Sulla the Dictator


LOL Ernst Roehm was the biggest gangster and criminal of the entire SA! They used to call him "Machine Gun" Roehm.

And how does an Anti-Semite believe in social justice and equality?
I see it this way, Roehm was a gangster (and yes, a gay blade as well) but he probibly would have been a better ruler than Hitler. Hitler started the worst war in history and if he was toppled at that time than maybe a lot of the bloodshead would have been avoided. At the very least, it would have stayed in Germany.

Originally posted by JAT
Can we have just one thread on DA about NS Germany without anti-Semitism becoming part of the discussion?

Its hard to seperate Nazism from anti-semitism. They go hand in hand. Its probibly the most infamous aspect of Hitler's regeim that some 6 mil jews died.

The SA wasn't the left wing; the strasserites were. Did the SA want to stage a revolution based on the Strasser brothers' ideals?

Originally posted by Johnson
The SA wasn't the left wing; the strasserites were. Did the SA want to stage a revolution based on the Strasser brothers' ideals?
I may be wrong but wasn't Strasser a member of the SA?

I think Strasser would really have been a good Furher, wouldn't he?

Originally posted by Criminal

I see it this way, Roehm was a gangster (and yes, a gay blade as well) but he probibly would have been a better ruler than Hitler.


Why?


Hitler started the worst war in history and if he was toppled at that time than maybe a lot of the bloodshead would have been avoided. At the very least, it would have stayed in Germany.


Well, if you mean that Roehm would have been more inept than Hitler and resulted in a collapse of Nazism sooner, then I agree. But he wasn't by any means a better man, in fact, in a lot of ways he was worse.

Originally posted by Sulla the Dictator


Why?



Well, if you mean that Roehm would have been more inept than Hitler and resulted in a collapse of Nazism sooner, then I agree. But he wasn't by any means a better man, in fact, in a lot of ways he was worse.
Yes, but honestly no leader in history could have envisioned a genocide like Hitler. Roehm and his bunch were bullies. Their methods were crude. They may have smashed some Jewish businesses and ultimately have run the Jews out of Germany but it really took a man like Hitler and his right hand man, Heydrich to engineer the world's worst genocide.

I also do not think that Roehm or the brownshirts envisioned a campaign of world conquest. In fact no sane person would think of such a thing.

Originally posted by Criminal

Yes, but honestly no leader in history could have envisioned a genocide like Hitler.


Which is why we should measure them as people, since you couldn't have made a choice at the time knowing the future.


Roehm and his bunch were bullies. Their methods were crude. They may have smashed some Jewish businesses and ultimately have run the Jews out of Germany but it really took a man like Hitler and his right hand man, Heydrich to engineer the world's worst genocide.


Oh I don't know. I think that instead of a SECRET campaign to exterminate Germany's Jewish population, you would have had a very public one. And an earlier one, as well, since Roehm's victory would have meant those organs of the German state which took Hitler six years to atrophy would have been wiped out in a single fell swoop, instead.


I also do not think that Roehm or the brownshirts envisioned a campaign of world conquest.


Well, I don't think Hitler envisioned a campaign of WORLD conquest, either. Roehm would have just been a more inept, more personally repulsive version of Hitler.
In fact no sane person would think of such a thing. [/QUOTE]