Was chatting with Johnson about this last night, wondered if any of you buffs out there knew a bit more about it than the sketchy few details we could stumble across on google.

http://www.cultures.com/features/Africa/zimbabwe/media/walls.jpg

http://www.lib.ohio-state.edu/bslweb/Great-Zimbabwe.jpeg
Great Zimbabwe Ruins - An Ancient City
The biggest example of ancient architecture south of the Great Pyramids can be found at Great Zimbabwe, the "house of stones" built by a once great and prosperous high culture.

Once thought to be the site of the legendary Mines of King Solomon, these ruins have long been the inspiration of adventurers and treasure hunters. Today, they act as both a testimony to a thousand-year-old civilization, and the proud symbol of a new country.

This World Heritage Site covers an area of over 700 hectares, and is the largest of the 150 stone settlements in Zimbabwe and the most significant ruins in sub-Saharan Africa. It is also an awe-inspiring sight.

Although many myths and legends once abounded about the origins of Great Zimbabwe, there is irrefutable proof that this was the royal court of the Shona kings until the 15th century. At the height of this dynasty, there were some 20 000 subjects whose influence spread far and wide, trading in gold and ivory and farming with cattle, sheep and goats. These medieval city-state dwellers expressed themselves graciously in art and architecture, and fascinating artifacts from antiquity can be viewed in the site museum.

http://www.e-gnu.com/country_info/zim/zim_011.html

It's interesting, but I really do not think this city was built by black africans without semitic influence.

zimbabwe has a long jewish history, im pretty sure this was built after they mixed.

Originally posted by Johnson
It's interesting, but I really do not think this city was built by black africans without semitic influence.

zimbabwe has a long jewish history, im pretty sure this was built after they mixed.
Were the mighty Jews as far south as Zimbabwe in the 13th century?

I know they'd gone to Ethiopia, but Zimbabwe's a bit further on the map.

Not much is known about the people and the culture of Great Zimbabwe. This is due to the fact that they had no written language and the oral traditions have not survived. What we do know is what they left behind in form of the Great Zimbabwe ruins. The Shona speaking people moved into the valley around 500 AD and began building major parts of the stone walls in the 1100s. Zimbabwe is the Shona word meaning house of rock.

The city of Great Zimbabwe is located in the present day country of Zimbabwe. Geographically it is located to the east of the Kalahari desert between the Zambezi and Limpopo rivers. The huge plains that surround the city can support agricultural and herding that the people of Great Zimbabwe needed to sustain themselves. It is interesting to note that although Great Zimbabwe is in the area of several rivers it is not actually on the shores of a river. The city appears to be in the middle of nowhere. It is believed, however, that the city was located on a gold-rich mine. Great Zimbabwe was used and built as a religious center and a place from which they worshipped Mwari, the creator of all life as well as the sustainer of all things.

The Elliptical building is the most impressive and extraordinary of the stone remains. The outer wall of the building is 32 feet high and up to 17 feet thick in parts. It stretches over 800 feet, forming a circumference with a maximum diameter of 293 feet. The inside of this building was probably reserved for the king or ruler for melting down gold in smelters. As well as being impressive for the fine granite walls, the city was very rich in gold. The people traded along the nearby Limpopo river. One of the most amazing aspects of this great civilization is that they had up to 20,000 people living around the elliptical building in mud huts. The huge stone buildings are built very straight and uniform and were very well planned in their construction. The stones in the major walls were perfectly fitted with each other and no mortar was used. The only openings in the wall were for the entrance and several drainage ditches. It is interesting to note the similarities of these walls to those of the castles built during Medieval Europe.

Great Zimbabwe is so well known because it is not known how it was constructed nor why the civilization declined around 1600. Much of this is due to the strange fact that the people of Great Zimbabwe left behind no record of a written language nor any oral traditions. The fact that the civilization disappeared as well as the impressive and mysterious walls make the Great Zimbabwe one of the truly lost civilizations of the world.

http://campus.northpark.edu/history/WebChron/Africa/GreatZimbabwe.html

http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/melwood/368/anczimb.html

http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99993137



Great Zimbabwe is a controversial site thought to have been a royal residence (Image: Corbis)



Viewers of the total solar eclipse in Southern Africa early on Wednesday have also had their eyes opened by second startling event - newly released evidence that a medieval African site was an astronomical observatory.

Starting just before 0600 GMT, the shadow of the Moon took 30 minutes to cross Africa from west to east, before heading over the Indian Ocean to make landfall in western Australia around 0900 GMT.

In Africa, between 0610 and 0620, the shadow crossed the southern tip of Zimbabwe, not far from the mysterious stone ruins of Great Zimbabwe, from which the country took its name.

Great Zimbabwe, built in about 1200 AD is a perplexing UN world heritage site. At its heart is the Great Enclosure - a wall comprised of over 5000 cubic metres of stone and marking a perimeter 240 metres in length. Archaeologists had assumed it was once a royal residence.

But on Wednesday, archaeologist-astronomer Richard Wade, of the Nkwe Ridge Observatory, South Africa, presented his new evidence. He claims Great Zimbabwe was similar in function to Stonehenge in England, though much younger.

Eclipse predictor


"This is the culmination of nearly 30 years of research," Wade told New Scientist. Central to his conclusion is the location of stone monoliths on the eastern arc of the Great Enclosure.

According to Wade, they line up with the rising of the Sun, Moon and bright stars at certain, astronomically significant times of the year. One of the more striking alignments that Wade has observed is the rise of three bright stars in Orion over three of the monoliths, on the morning of the winter solstice, the shortest day of the year.


The patterns have previously been interpreted as those on snake skin (Image: Natural History Museum, Bulawayo)

One monolith could also be an eclipse predictor. Wade says it is notched in such a way that "the pattern and amount of notches can only be a record of the Venus' alignments with Earth, and we know that the location of Venus in the sky can be used to predict eclipses. It also has crescents and discs carved into it."

Perhaps most contentiously, Wade believes he knows why a conical tower that has previously baffled archaeologists was built. "The conical tower lines up precisely with the supernova known to have exploded in Vela, 700 to 800 years ago," he says.


Chance alignments





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Weblinks


Nkwe Ridge Observatory

Great Zimbabwe, UNESCO

Eclipses, NASA




His work so far has been vetted by astronomers from the South African Astronomical Observatory and will be submitted to scientific journals.

However, some experts warn that there are so many stones on the walls of the Great Enclosure that some chance alignments are inevitable. Researchers should be careful of reading too much into them, they say, adding that more work is needed before Great Zimbabwe's use as an observatory is proven.

David Dearborn, a physicist at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory who has also studied Mayan astronomy in South America, notes that spectacular sites like Great Zimbabwe and Stonehenge pose a particular scientific challenge because they are one-offs.

Astronomical alignments of objects at such sites may be suggestive but chance cannot be ruled out. Dearborn adds that studies of numerous smaller sites can provide statistical support for such alignments, as can evidence from oral histories that people who used the site had astronomical knowledge.


Stuart Clark and Damian Carrington

Originally posted by Johnson
It's interesting, but I really do not think this city was built by black africans without semitic influence.

zimbabwe has a long jewish history, im pretty sure this was built after they mixed.

http://www.kulanu.org/visitrusape.html



In a recent edition of the Kulanu newsletter, a brief story about the Rusape congregation in Zimbabwe was mentioned. We are currently living in Lusaka, Zimbia. During the recent holiday season, our family traveled to Rusape and here is a brief description of our experiences.

We arranged to stay with Shlomo Guwazah and his family. He has three grown sons (David 18, Tesfah 17, and Daniel 13) from a British wife and one 2-year-old son (Kudzi) from his Zimbabwean wife, Monica. We were welcomed into their home like family. We stayed for two nights and by the time we left we felt like family. It was the first time we were welcomed to live in an African home.

Shlomo shared a lot about his past journeying into Rastafarianism, Christianity, and Judaism for the last 15-20 years. The Jewish congregation he attends practices "prophetic" Judaism, which originated in Virginia about 100 years ago; it is affiliated with African American Beth El Congregations. They define prophetic in the sense of their leaders and the fact that each one of us is truly a prophet of God. Shlomo described how he and the Rusape Jews feel a connection with Judaism that harmonizes with their historical Shona heritage of a belief in one God. They described the need to reconnect to their ancient past in order to find the strength and the framework to take control of their lives and fulfill the vision of the African Renaissance. Individuals are trying to buck centuries of oppression by traditional leaders, colonialists, and modern-day cultural imperialism to assume ownership and control of their own destinies. Shlomo believes that Judaism is the path.

On Sabbath morning, we went with Shlomo and his family for whole day (9 am-4 pm), an experience that we will never forget. The tabernacle (synagogue) sits on the side of a small mountain by a lake. It was spectacular. The tabernacle was filled to capacity with over 100 people. The rabbi welcomed us and described the origins of their belief and their delight in sharing their rituals and customs with us. This was a cultural mind blowout! You cannot imagine how enchanting it was to hear 50 Africans in a choir singing a new version of the Shema (the most sacred prayer in Judaism) in a combined English, Hebrew, and Shona. They sang Adon Olam, David Melech Yisrael, and many other songs in English and Shona. The music and chanting was revivalist in nature and Judaic in spirit! The Shona songs were our favorite, even though we don't know what they meant. The kids played outside, drew water from the well, ate pomegranates, and chased turkeys. After the morning service the congregation had lunch together followed by singing and announcements. During the announcements the rabbi said something in Shona and then they sent a collection around and gave the money to Monica. Later we learned the money was to help feed us.

After we left the tabernacle we went with Shlomo and Daniel to the village that he grew up in and where his mother still lives. The village was about 20 minutes outside of Rusape. Her house was well developed for a village home, with several rooms in the main house. She had traditional rondovels (round huts) -- one was the kitchen and another was where her maize is stored. As we approached the house, Shlomo's uncle and grandmother welcomed us. His grandmother took an immediate liking to Paul, flirting with him. She had been drinking way too much of their homemade brew and she was stumbling through the maize fields. We were given a traditional welcome inside her living room where she and three other relatives bent their knees and clapped their hands. We then had drinks outside since she has no electricity and it was quite dark inside Outside her house she had a large maize field and beautiful rock-formed hills. The children ran around chasing her goats.

Several days later we rejoined the Rusape tabernacle for the celebration of the Convocation of the Feast of Tevet. This gathering recalls the destruction of the Temple in Jerusalem and the migration of Jews into Africa. This is one of their high holidays. The tabernacle was even more crowded than before, and the choir was complete, with about 70 people. The energy was overwhelming! The whole congregation stays together for eight days with prayers beginning at 4 am. Each day they pray in a different position, beginning with standing; on the last day they are lying flat on the floor.

Rabbi Ambros Makuwaza told the congregation how appreciative he is of all the different people he has met through Kulanu and the gifts that the tabernacle has received. We are now working with the Rusape tabernacle to help them develop a proposal and get a sponsor to produce a CD and a tape. We are hoping that Kulanu will get involved.

Originally posted by Johnson
It's interesting, but I really do not think this city was built by black africans without semitic influence.

zimbabwe has a long jewish history, im pretty sure this was built after they mixed.

...You believe that the tiny Jewish population on the Mediteranean, PASSED Egypt and Nubian populations, the harshness of the Ethiop and Sudanese deserts, to colonize ZIMBABWE?

Well these historians are saying they thought great zimbabwe lay upon the goldmines of king solomon.

zimbabwe has a long jewish history sulla.

http://www.haruth.com/JewsZimbabwe.html

Originally posted by Johnson
Well these historians are saying they thought great zimbabwe lay upon the goldmines of king solomon.


"Historians"? Maybe you'll like this then. :p

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0813512778/103-9054191-3625428?v=glance

Black Spark, White Fire: Did African Explorers Civilize Ancient Europe? by Richard Poe (Paperback)

Hahahah. Thanks for the laugh, Sulla. :D

Originally posted by Johnson
Black Spark, White Fire: Did African Explorers Civilize Ancient Europe? by Richard Poe (Paperback)

Hahahah. Thanks for the laugh, Sulla. :D

I thought you would like it. :p In essence the same argument as this "Mines of Solomon" silliness.

So if Black Africans advanced beyond mud huts to stone structures, how come they only built ONE?

Why isn't africa full of stone cities and buildings?

Why did the people live AROUND great zimbabwe in mud huts?

why do africans continue to live in mud huts if they used stone?

i dont buy it.

Originally posted by Johnson
So if Black Africans advanced beyond mud huts to stone structures, how come they only built ONE?


Well, by that argument, the Aztecs were Jews because the Souix didn't have stone cities?

Is that right?

The Romans were Jews because the Germans didn't have stone cities?

Both the Aztecs and the Romans built more than one example of a stone city. Since this is the only example in this area it is not unreasonable to assume it was not constructed by the local inhabitants. If it was, there would be many more examples. A civilization doesn't just build a place like that without first developing their building skills.

Originally posted by Chris
Both the Aztecs and the Romans built more than one example of a stone city. Since this is the only example in this area it is not unreasonable to assume it was not constructed by the local inhabitants. If it was, there would be many more examples. A civilization doesn't just build a place like that without first developing their building skills.

I'd be surprised if there was either the funding or the opportunity (Due to internal circumstances) for large scale excavations in a number of African nations.

Why don't you show us some Jewish art from this site. Or ANY evidence that these people were Jews. Maybe its a GERMAN city! What does March of the Titans say about it?

There are 300 such structures on the plains of Zimbabwe: http://www.archaeology.org/9807/abstracts/africa.html

There's a moderately involved discussion between myself and jack_boot on GZ starting here: http://www.discussanything.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39987&perpage=20&pagenumber=6

Basically, there are neither mines nor nearby port contemporary with GZ, which would seem to rule out the possibility that it was a colonial outpost, and there's no evidence of any culture other than that of the natives being present at the time of construction. We don't know much about the builders, and it is indeed possible that they weren't native Africans. It's almost as likely as is the possibility that the builders of Stonehenge in fact came from Siberia. :|

Why do black africans today live in mud huts?

Originally posted by Sulla the Dictator


I'd be surprised if there was either the funding or the opportunity (Due to internal circumstances) for large scale excavations in a number of African nations.

Why don't you show us some Jewish art from this site. Or ANY evidence that these people were Jews. Maybe its a GERMAN city! What does March of the Titans say about it?

Please point out where I claimed it was a Jewish city.

Originally posted by Johnson
Why do black africans today live in mud huts?
Perhaps its because mud is an abundent building material in africa. Remember too that some europeans in Scandenavia used simple timber cabins. White settlers on the praries built simple sod houses.

Some black africans have built very elaborate structures as well...

case in point, note the cities of the Dogon people of Mali....


http://www.sagatours.com/images/Bananitoguna.jpeg

http://www.sagatours.com/images/greniers.jpeg http://www.sagatours.com/images/nandomosque6.jpeg

Originally posted by Johnson
Why do black africans today live in mud huts?
Why not?

Originally posted by Chris


Please point out where I claimed it was a Jewish city.

Who built it? You're implying blacks didn't. Who did?

What does March of the Titans say, Chris?

Why do black africans today live in mud huts?

Cause Lowes and Home depot are too expensive and mud is free?

Originally posted by Johnson
Why isn't africa full of stone cities and buildings?

fewer wars, and better weather?

Originally posted by Sulla the Dictator


Who built it? You're implying blacks didn't. Who did?

How am I supposed to know?


What does March of the Titans say, Chris?

I've never read it. You tell me.

Originally posted by Sulla the Dictator


Who built it? You're implying blacks didn't. Who did?


Some say the Phonecians. Does it matter? The point is that it's illogical to assume it was built by Africans when they built nothing like it before or after.

The point is that it's illogical to assume it was built by Africans when they built nothing like it before or after.
There are 300 such structures there. If such a large-scale project had been undertaken by the Phoenicians or whoever, why do none of their records refer to it? Why does the design bear no resemblance to theirs? Where is the port and transport network linking it to the areas of Phoenician dominion? Given the scale of the construction, the absence of a nearby port to facilitate access, the absence of references in the surviving records of contemporary civilisations, and the absence of evidence of other peoples in the region, it's illogical in the extreme to believe it to have been built by anyone other than an indigenous population.

Originally posted by kaleun

Some say the Phonecians. Does it matter? The point is that it's illogical to assume it was built by Africans when they built nothing like it before or after.
Mayby it was built by Space Aliens. Read Van Danikans' (sp?) Chariots of the Gods.

What is illogical in the extreme is to believe it to have been built by a population which had never built similar structures in the past and never would in the future.

Originally posted by Chris
What is illogical in the extreme is to believe it to have been built by a population which had never built similar structures in the past and never would in the future.

That's the confusing thing, but this is a different race we're talking about. Perhaps a burst of creative energy here and there, far exceeding the other tribes in the negro matrix, is in the natural order of development for them.

Besides, the complex is not in total isolation, as we are told by investigators there are hundreds of stone structures in the vicinity.

Of course, I have seen no photos of such accompanying structures, nor map of the layout. Perhaps our investigators, thirsting for politically correct evidence of African civilization, exaggerate.

Jonny, one correction, every report I can find on GZ mentions gold mines in the area.

Sulla, the jewish connection was featured in a recent Nova special promoting the idea that a tribe of black jews, the Lemba, built GZ.

Points:

The stonework is not representative of the stonework of any of the known explorer races of the time.

The complex is far inland and no roads connect it to any port facility.

The complex is particularly puzzling as it is of no conceivable use. There are no parapets, gangways, or crenellations on the walls; I have seen no evidence of stairs for gaining the height of the walls. This argues against it being a fortification, although it's possible that stairs and so forth were made of wood and are long gone. Still, we'd see some trace where such wood superstructure was made fast.

There is no evidence of any waterworks. A poor residence without waterworks, and anybody who could do this with stone could also dig ditches and lay sluice. There's none of it. Why not?

The theory above suggests an astronomical design, but what for? To mark seasons? What seasons? Were these farming people? The soil is said to be poor; though perhaps a thousand years ago the soil was better, but had been depleted to uselessness in a few centuries. See the Great Dust Bowl in the history books. Still, of what use is an observatory in this area?

GZ was apparently abandoned before the first Europeans found their way there. Why was it abandoned? War? Famine? Plague? The mines had certainly played out - perhaps that is why.

Fascinating mystery; but so far, I'd say the evidence tends to argue against colonial construction.