I think that one of the misconceptions about Christians is that we think we're perfect and we never sin. Maybe that's one of the reasons why some people don't want to become Christian - because they think that they could never give up certain things, and become "sinless" or a goody-two-shoes.

This is what I want to try to clear up.

Here's the thing. When you become a new Christian, you do change. Let me reprhase that. You don't do the changing yourself, but you are changed. (2 Corinthians 5:17 (http://www.biblegateway.com/cgi-bin/bible?passage=2COR%2B5%3A17&showfn=on&showxref=on&language=english&version=KJV&x=10&y=10)) At that moment of regeneration, God gives you a new heart, and you become sealed with His Spirit.

But does that mean you become perfect? No. NOBODY is perfect (but God). And does that mean that you never again sin? No... Christians can fall into sin, and do go through struggles - spiritual struggles. In Romans 7, Paul talks about this - the conflict between the intention for good, and the action of sin (that comes from our old human nature) (Romans 7:15-25 (http://www.biblegateway.com/cgi-bin/bible?passage=ROM%2B7%3A15-25&showfn=on&showxref=on&language=english&version=NIV&x=9&y=9))

I've been going through a struggle with sin, in the last few months. (well, one thing in particular...i'm not going to get into details) :) It's been a really tough thing to go through... and for a while I think it was separating me from God. A friend of mine here told me - "God hasn't gone anywhere." I'm the one who strayed. (not those exact words, but you get the point) Now I'm trying to get back on the right track, but I'm still dealing with it. To the believers reading this... I could use your prayers. and I've also been praying. That's about it... thanks you all.

Love,
cindy

I think you're are completely right. I struggled when I was new in my walk w/ christ because I wasn't sure if I could give up all my sin. I admit, sin is fun, but pointless and God revealed to me just how meaningless it is.

I think another awesome verse is "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." Romans 3:23

I've also been strugling in my walk. I feel as if I am repeating and repeating a sin and it is so fustrating. I feel ashamed when I ask God to forgive me for the same sin. God's grace is beyond our conception.

I will be praying for you Cindy.:)

I need a journal:p

I'm not that new in my walk. I'm almost 3 years old. :D

but yeah, this thing I've been dealing with over the last few months has been tough...and frustrating. but you're right. God's grace is so amazing, and a lot of times I feel totally unworthy... but I want to become a better christian.

Thanks so much for your prayers! :) and yeah, I wish you had a journal! I guess they changed the rules recently.. before everyone could get one for free. We should have a talk with Manu. ;)

thanks again Rudy!

love,
cindy

Originally posted by buttercup
I'm not that new in my walk. I'm almost 3 years old. :D
Now that I re-read my post it does look like that...but I was just referring to me when I was new. You seem to be a very mature Christian and I'm suprised you've only been saved for 3 years.

I think the hardest thing for me is going before God every night knowing that I have sinned. I feel guilty and unworthy to be in His presence. I constantly have to remind myself that His Love is beyond my understanding.


And yea...I'm thinking of becoming a primo soon...and not just for the journal but to help Manu out alittle. I need one so I can stop taking over yours.:p

Yeah, I figured that's what you meant after I posted. :) and thank you, but I don't feel that I'm spiritually mature yet. I definitely know what you're saying about going before God. But it's easy to see that you have a heart for God, so that's a very good thing. :)

btw, I'll pray for you too. and hey, I like when you post in my journal, in fact, feel free to post a thread(s) here, if you feel like it! :p

you got my prayers girl! and you too Rudy, and feel free to post in my journal too whenever ya feel "journally" ;

and i think that is definitely a major misconception- one of many in fact. that is a big deal for me, especially because i'm a newer christian too (2 years)--- just the fact that people hear that someone is a Christian and thinks they know so much about them. and i think that has bothered me even more these past months as i've completely separated myself from all of my church friends (for a few reasons)... because when you have a whole community behind you, things are a lot different than when you have to pick and choose which battles to fight on your own and which things you just have to say, "hey thats how the world is" about.

Alright Bonnie! Now I have two DA prayer partners! Whopee! I know what you are say'n about your church friends bonnie. I have seen too many church clicks in my years as a christian and have tried my best to stay out of them. But the key is to look past those clicks and focus on the real reason why you are their, to worship God. You guys are awesome.;)

Originally posted by 20_cent
Alright Bonnie! Now I have two DA prayer partners! Whopee! I know what you are say'n about your church friends bonnie. I have seen too many church clicks in my years as a christian and have tried my best to stay out of them. But the key is to look past those clicks and focus on the real reason why you are their, to worship God. You guys are awesome.;)

the click-ishness wasnt really my complaint... i think it was more like a difference of cultural opinions in a way. I mean, i understand the whole trying to stay away from sin thing-- but i dont think you should have to cringe when you hear a four letter word, or run out of the movie theater because someone is making out on the screen. :shrug:

but there are things that i really miss and im totally at a crossroads of what im gonna do next year now that i am moving out and i planned on going back to church (because i wasnt allowed to while i was living at home) but i dont know if i want to go to the church i was at, but i might be even more hesistant to start over with another church... i dunno.

ahhh...I should have remembered our convo we had a while back. I think some people have just been sheltered their whole life and when they finally get out into the real world they deal with it the only way they have ever been taught. I can't imagine being in the situation that you're in(not being able to go to church). I admire your faith. And about your decision on returning to your old church or finding a new one: "Don't find one that suits you, find one that suits God." I don't remember where I heard it though.;)

You've all obviously skipped you classes on how to be piously judgemental and how to alienate newbies by intimidation.


:D



My sister had a sticker on her door when I was a kid- it read:

Christians aren't perfect. Just forgivien.

She kept it in her room to remind herself.

>You've all obviously skipped you classes on how to be piously judgemental and how to alienate newbies by intimidation.<

Well, Cindy assures me that she can make it up if she takes summer classes.
;)

Originally posted by TheFrog
Christians aren't perfect. Just forgivien.
Thats a good one.:nice:

*stores in memory*

One of the common misconceptions of new Christians is that soon after salvation, they will become free from temptation, not affected by that which is outside themselves, and have total victory, just because they were told that faith in Christ gives them victory over sin.

Believers must remember, it is work. It is not easy.

For the Christian, we must look at the Old Testament, and what happened to the Israelites, and then look at their experiences and think of a few things: The act of salvation is similar to the Israelies being freed from bondage from Egypt, and the tests the Israelites faced in their early stage represent sin in the believers life, and the victories or defeats a Christian can expect to see in their own life.

Remember when Israel crossed the Red Sea on dry land? Who made it dry? God did. Not Moses. So who did the work? God did. All the Israelites were supposed to do was believe and watch.

(Exo 14:13 KJV) And Moses said unto the people, Fear ye not, stand still, and see the salvation of the LORD, which he will show to you to day: for the Egyptians whom ye have seen to day, ye shall see them again no more for ever.

(Exo 14:14 KJV) The LORD shall fight for you, and ye shall hold your peace.

(Exo 14:15 KJV) And the LORD said unto Moses, Wherefore criest thou unto me? speak unto the children of Israel, that they go forward:

(Exo 14:16 KJV) But lift thou up thy rod, and stretch out thine hand over the sea, and divide it: and the children of Israel shall go on dry ground through the midst of the sea.
Notice how the people were supposed to be going forward, why in the world was Moses asking God anything? Get the people moving! They already had their orders! They were to obey!

Notice Moses, STAND STILL, that was not a command to freeze and do nothing, but a command to watch, and pay attention, rest, trust God, God will fight for you.

God does that for those who are first in obedience with His word.

That is the most important thing we can ever say. Forget about forgiveness for sins committed after confession, how about oveying God in the first place?

Get it? Most of the time, we Christians do NOT obey. Our sins are not 'accidents', that are things we tell ourselves we really do not want to do, that we felt almost possessed when we did it, that we only did it onceandIconfesseditleavemealone!

When instead, we were just supposed to obey. Israel saw God spread the Red Sea, they walked through on dry land, and saw Pharoah's entire army destroyed, they were safe!

Did they trust God?

No. Because of unbelief, they just didnt hang on to what they saw and witnessed.

We Christians have the same problem. We dont really know what we are supposed to have believed, else, we would not fall into sin so easily!

That's the key to any victorious Christian life: obedience.

With obedience, you get regular prayer, you get mercy shown to others, you control yourself, your behaviour, your music you listen to, your church attendence, everything.

If Israel only obeyed then.

BUT, With obedience, can often come pride, thinking that you OBEYED so GOD OWES YOU!

We have anything through God's grace, not through our works. Our works are nothing more than filthy rags.

(Isa 64:6 KJV) But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

I have found the only time I really had God's will in my life, is when I recognized I was totally unworthy of anything, that in my flesh, I did not please God.

Sounds easy to state, but how many have really come to that state?

We must place all we have on the altar, hand it over to God to run and to control, and to lead, and we must die. We must take ourselves out of the equation, and we must let God do the work in us.

Below is part of a study on this on the Christian life, click on the link for more:

"I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me." (Galatians 2:20)

"But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me." (1 Corinthians 15:10)

"Oh to grace how great a debtor daily I'm constrained to be!" "Praise the Saviour ye who know Him! Who can tell how much we owe Him! Gladly let us render to Him all we are and have!" (Taken from two Hymns)

It is essential that every believer examine the Scriptures diligently to see what God teaches concerning the Christian life and how it is to be lived. There are many false views being held today, such as the view which says that the believer is under the law as a rule of life and as a means of sanctification. Scofield countered this false teaching in his note which is found under Galatians 1:6, "The test of the Gospel is grace. If the message excludes grace, or mingles law with grace as the means either of justification or sanctification (Gal. 2:21; 3:1-3), or denies the fact or guilt of sin which alone gives grace its occasion and opportunity, it is 'another' gospel, and the preacher of it is under the anathema of God."

Source: http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/christia/belived.htm

Remember also, that none of this can happen if we don't believe as we should.

ARE YOU CLAIMING THESE FACTS BY FAITH?
Faith is the key to victory in the Christian life (1 John 5:4-5; Gal. 2:20). I received Christ as my Saviour by faith (John 1:12) and in the same way I am to walk and live the Christian life (Col. 2:5-6; 2 Cor. 5:7; Gal. 3:1-3). It is not by fleshly trying or struggling, but it is by faith. It is not my working (Heb. 4:10), but it is God working in me (Phil. 2:13; Heb. 13:21). It is for me to actively and whole-heartedly trust in Him to do His great working in and through me.
Source: http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/christia/livfaith.htm

One other thing the Believer must remember, is Christ lives inside them!

If you are saved, you have the Holy Spirit inside you!

Angels agood and bad are watching you!

If you are willingly sinning, they all know it.

So does Jesus.

Read this study, it might help a little:


Consider the fact of His presence

"I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee" (Heb. 13:5).

"I will fear no evil: for Thou art with me" (Psalm 23:4)

"And the LORD, He it is that doth go before thee; He will be with thee, He will not fail thee, neither forsake thee: fear not, neither be dismayed" (Deut. 31:8).

"Fear thou not; for I am with thee: be not dismayed; for I am thy God: I will strengthen thee; yea, I will help thee; yea, I will uphold thee with the right hand of my righteousness" (Isa. 41:10).

"Immanuel...God with us" (Matthew 1:23).

"...Lo, I am with you alway(s), even unto the end of the world (age)" (Matt. 28:20).

source: http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/christia/presence.htm

Originally posted by Banky

If you are willingly sinning, they all know it.
Aren't most sins 'willingly sins'?

good scriptures.:nice:

Originally posted by 20_cent
Aren't most sins 'willingly sins'?

good scriptures.:nice:
Yes, I meant the sins that are the ones we do only 'once' instead of a 'habit', thinking, "Oh, Jesus, you know I am weak in that spot"...

Originally posted by Banky

Yes, I meant the sins that are the ones we do only 'once' instead of a 'habit', thinking, "Oh, Jesus, you know I am weak in that spot"... Okay...gotcha...I am guilty of that at times.:(

Originally posted by Banky

Yes, I meant the sins that are the ones we do only 'once' instead of a 'habit', thinking, "Oh, Jesus, you know I am weak in that spot"... Okay...gotcha...I am guilty of that at times.:(

Bonnie, thank you! :) You rock. I'm not sure where you live, but if you decide to look for a new church, you should try my old church (when I lived in LA). I think I told you about it before. It's the most awesome church I've ever been to, I loved it. It's Metro church in Santa Monica. actually, I just did a search to find the address for you and the site says they're temporarily in a different location until they can fix the place they were at. :confused: hmm, well.. here's a link for you >click< (http://www.metrochurch.org/index.htm). Thanks again, and I'll add you to my prayers, too!



lol@Froggie :p And yeah, I've heard that saying before, it's very true. :nice:


Thanks Banky, for taking the time to post that! :) I'll check out that site!

Yeah, so I'm not a Christian, but I thought I'd make a note. I don't think I've ever thought that Christians think they're perfect. I don't know why anyone would generalize like that. :shrug:

Thanks Lat. :) Maybe I should've put it differently... let me rephrase it. One misconception some people have is that because Christians denounce sin or immorality, that must mean they think they're better, or that they never sin. The truth is - the reason most Christians become a Christian in the first place is that we know we are sinners... in need of God's forgiveness. That goes for EVERYONE. No one is good or perfect, so everyone needs forgiveness.

Like Frog said: Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven. Of course, the goal is to follow the example of Christ, and to try to avoid doing the wrong thing. But (like I said on page 1) sometimes that doesn't happen.

~ cc

^^^^ YIkes I saw that on a bumper sticker once while driving around. An easy wy to undermine the stereotype is to have an attitude of "to each their own" But the whole bear witness thingy makes for some instances of pushy "compassion" that usually has an ulterior conversion motive. This is mostly in the evangelical ranks and the missionaries they deploy around the world.