President cites national security, ongoing litigation
WASHINGTON, D.C. - Citing national security concerns and ongoing litigation against the government, President Bush has chosen again to keep secret Air Force operations near Groom Lake in western Lincoln County.

Bush issued the presidential determination, made public last week, in a memo sent September 13 to the heads of the Environmental Protection Agency and the Air Force.

In his memorandum, Bush said it was of "paramount interest" to exempt the base-also known as Area 51 - from the disclosure of classified information.

The government has acknowledged the installation's existence but refuses to disclose work at the top-secret facility.

Like his predecessor Bill Clinton, Bush cited two pending Nevada court cases seeking information about the base operations brought by Helen Frost and Stella Kasza, widows of two men who worked at the military base.

The women say their husbands were exposed to hazardous and toxic materials at the installation, which sits along a dry lakebed in Lincoln County, about 40 miles north of Pahrump.
The one-page memo exempts the Air Force from adhering to federal, state, interstate or local laws regarding solid waste or hazardous waste if classified information would be disclosed.

The annual presidential directive keeps secret information regarding operations at the base, including documents and testimony Frost and Kasza are seeking to link Area 51 to their husbands' deaths, said Jonathan Turley, the George Washington University law professor who represents the plaintiffs.

"The information being withheld includes information that would show the government knowingly committed crimes that may have killed two workers and injured countless others," Turley said. "We will continue to litigate this case until the true facts are out."

The White House referred calls to the Defense Department, which did not return calls seeking comment.

Clinton was the first president to sign the annual exemption in 1995, which stemmed from the Frost and Kasza cases.
Turley said Bush's order establishes an historical record that the government "covered up crimes at Area 51 and prevented the public from the knowledge."


http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=6634864&BRD=1125&PAG=461&dept_id=99545&rfi=6

Those poor wives. Imagine, your husband suffers from some wack disease due to his work and the governtment hides the fact or doesn't even bother to disclose what happened?

There's two sides here, and I'm struggling. While, I don't want secrets kept from me, especially ones that are paid for by the tax dollars of US citizens - does the government have a right to protect it's secrets in our best interest? On the other hand, what do they have to hide from us? Are they not representing *us*?

If the men who died were exposed to some form of toxicants then it must have come out with the autospy...what would the government have to hide by denying exposure?

From what I can tell Area 51 is mostly a weapons testing facility. I just can't picture a swarm of EPA guys going in there and walking out alive:p

I think there is a Stargate Program there. A wormhole that allows Elite squads of US Soldiers to travel to different worlds and gather information and weapons in order to protect us from the Goaul'd. :|

-Æ (I mean... nothing.... )

I know National Secrets are a bitch aren't they? I mean let's just tell the whole world what our secret military capabilites are...:rolleyes:

John

Somehow I suspect that the author's imagination would be a lot more entertaining than the "truth" (which may or may not be out there, depending on who you trust).

Originally posted by ISUPonyBoy
I know National Secrets are a bitch aren't they? I mean let's just tell the whole world what our secret military capabilites are...:rolleyes:

John


I think your stretching it a bit..

Nobody wants to know our "secret military capabilities"..

What we want to know is what is going on there in regards to Alien technology and recovered ET spececraft. Something which the government has no right to keep secret from us. Last time I checked they worked for us, not the other way around.

And if people are dying that work there things need to be done about it. The military isn't above the law.. Well it is, but it shouldn't be.

Telling us they had a stealth fighter didn't include Blueprints on how to build one, if they expect to tax us to death they better tell us what our money is being spent on. Abd since aea 51 is the most secretive military base in the world how do we know what's going on there is done to protect us? What if something more sinister is going on?

Originally posted by buggy
Those poor wives. Imagine, your husband suffers from some wack disease due to his work and the governtment hides the fact or doesn't even bother to disclose what happened?

Yea, but if they told us, suddenly our enemies would be able to kill us! National security!! {sarcasm**


There's two sides here, and I'm struggling. While, I don't want secrets kept from me, especially ones that are paid for by the tax dollars of US citizens - does the government have a right to protect it's secrets in our best interest? On the other hand, what do they have to hide from us? Are they not representing *us*?

I think those are good questions, I look at the federal government which has disdain for the American people and I have my answer. They have everything to hide from us, they aren't representing *us* anymore...

The government sometimes needs to keep secrets including about aliens although I think the tie between area 51 and extraterrestrials is the figment of someone's imagination. If we were working on a new fuel or weapon, we wouldn't want the world to know about it. Heck we wouldn't even want some americans to know EPA ect would probably decide it was too harmful to the environment or something and then all of the little tree huggers that feel the need to "do something" would rush the place and do something stupid. The public would be outraged after an expose conducted by Geraldo Rivera and the government would be forced to stop research due to the public outcry.

By keeping things under wraps, people can feel safe that the government is doing its job and keeping our country protected. Some of us who are more activist than others (read: Timothy McVey SP?) have given the government no choice but to keep possibly controversial research secret from the public.

Possible Alien contact is one thing, military secrets is another. I don't care if they say yeah ET was here and he likes Elvis. As of right now I don't think an alien race capable of traveling millions of light years would care about our small blue peeble. Besides if they did and we as a population found out about it, it would be mayhem. So confirm aliens or not, I don't care. Keep military secrets, that just makes sense.

John

Originally posted by Jay13
The government sometimes needs to keep secrets including about aliens

Uh.. How about no to that...

If indeed the government is keeping evidence of Extraterrestrial contact a secret which I believe to be 100% true then they can rot in hell for a Gigaquadrillion eternities.

A profound event such as that [The most important discovery in human history) has no business being kept secret, the people of this world deserve and have every right to know. The government that works for US has no moral, ethical, or reasonable right to keep such a thing from the people. And again shows their utter contempt for the people of this world. WE pay their salary, THEY work for US. NOT the other way around. Alien technology could perhaps give us incredible new technologies that can advance the human race beyond the barbaric state we're now in. How in Gods name could you think they should keep this from us??? The majority of people believe in Aliens anyway, people aren't going to go crazy if they come out with what they know. C'mon..


although I think the tie between area 51 and extraterrestrials is the figment of someone's imagination.


Key word has been bolded by me. If you go through life on assumptions and guesses, you aren't going to be a very enlighted individual, going and bombing people that haven't done anything to you or me because you "think" Bush is a good guy telling the truth. If you want information you have to seek it out for yourself, watching the boob tube doesn't cut it. Do you think the information that is fed to us anywhere near the "truth"? Just because something is mainstream thought or is on the television doesn't make it true. I'm not saying that's how you get all your info but it seems that way..



If we were working on a new fuel or weapon, we wouldn't want the world to know about it.


New fuel? And exactly how would showing what is going on in the base tell us the details that a foreign country would need to steal our ideas? We know what goes on in the the Los Alamos labs, why aren't our enemies stealing our secrets from there? Think about it.

A new weapon? They aren't too secretive with some of the advanced sonic/laser/microwave weapons. What would command such secrecy unless it was something with sinister intent? We already have the capability to wipe out the World hudreds of times over, what new voo doo weapon would we need to keep secret?



Heck we wouldn't even want some americans to know EPA ect would probably decide it was too harmful to the environment or something and then all of the little tree huggers that feel the need to "do something" would rush the place and do something stupid.


OOooooookkkk.. Reading that made me feel like an old English man watching a bad sitcom... what rubbish...

Do you really think the EPA which is run by corporate executives gives a rats ass about the environment? The same one that just ruled that wetlands are ok for development?

What would "tree huggers" do that was "stupid", can you give me an example?

Who would care if they were developing some new fuel? And if so, it would probably be much cleaner than our current ones anyway..



The public would be outraged after an expose conducted by Geraldo Rivera and the government would be forced to stop research due to the public outcry.


Are you a comedian or something? Oh like they stopped building those Stealth fighters and that SR-71 When they acknowledged their existance?

Geraldo? He does exposes? On who? Al Capones vaults?


By keeping things under wraps, people can feel safe that the government is doing its job and keeping our country protected.


Oh brother, now that is scary, and you're in our military right?
Can you say naive?

Wouldn't it have been wise to learn about the government that you are taking orders from before submitting yourself to them?

I guess that's kind of how they protected John F. Kennedy right?

And how they protected those people in Waco by burning them alive, and shooting Randy Weavers wife while she held her baby in her arms right? And how they ignored repeated warnings about 9-11 letting 3000 Americans die? If that's how they protect us I sure would hate to see them stop:rolleyes:



Some of us who are more activist than others (read: Timothy McVey SP?) have given the government no choice but to keep possibly controversial research secret from the public.


Uh? .........................////////////////////////

What secret research did the government do that led McVeigh to want to blow up the federal building in OKC?

You call burning Americans in Waco "research"????????????


Jeebus...

Originally posted by ISUPonyBoy
Possible Alien contact is one thing, military secrets is another. I don't care if they say yeah ET was here and he likes Elvis. As of right now I don't think an alien race capable of traveling millions of light years would care about our small blue peeble. Besides if they did and we as a population found out about it, it would be mayhem. So confirm aliens or not, I don't care. Keep military secrets, that just makes sense.

John


You don't think they are, it is completely possible for an advaced type 1, 2, or 3, civilization. You're still thinking in 20th century technological ways. Imagine where we'll be in 1000 years if we survive that long? Now imagin 10,000, now imagine a million.

And how and why would there be "mayhem" if they came forward with the truth?

Remember, we're talking about real life here, not the movies. Would you go and create "Mayhem" if they told us? I'd think you wouldn't.

Well you may not care about the most important discovery in the history of mankind, but many others do, and being inhabitants of this universe we have the absolute right to know. The petty joke of a government on capitol hill has no right to keep it from us.

And it's kinda funny too, the same people that support the complete destruction of our rights to privacy think the government and the military deserve absolute privacy. Why should the government be allowed to run a spy agency on the American people out of the Pentagon yet we're not even allowed to know about ET contact which has no bearing on national security. Something is dead wrong about that..

As regards hush-hush info, see the Freedom of Information Act, your only link to Gov't secrets (as a civilian without a clearance). Until you get a job working on base in a need-to-know capacity, you'll just have to wait in line with everyone else, Mr. Caped Crusader. You're not a rocket scientist, by the way, are you?

Consider: Maybe its all been hidden in plain sight all this time. If I told you that my cult was in contact with ETs that told us to start cloning the Master Race, I'd be a nut, right? Define "Truth", and you'll have your answers.

Look at this way:

Somethings are just better left unknown. It would not surprise me what goes on that the general public doesnt know about.

Could you imagine the public panic if everything were known that goes on? Hysteria...