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Redfield
07-24-2002, 07:43 PM
Why Men Don't Hear Wedding Bells
Tue Jul 23,11:49 PM ET
By Jennifer Thomas
HealthScoutNews Reporter

TUESDAY, July 23 (HealthScoutNews) -- If you're a woman waiting for your live-in boyfriend to pop the question, moving out might be smarter than leaving pictures of engagement rings on the coffee table.

New research that's sure to anger some women has found that men's top reason for avoiding the altar is that they can get sex without marriage easier than in times past.

The second most common reason?

They can enjoy the benefits of having a wife by cohabitation rather than marriage.

"Cohabitation contributes to men's delay of marriage," says Barbara Dafoe Whitehead, co-author of the study and co-director of the National Marriage Project at Rutgers University.

Whitehead -- who happens to be the mother of two, single 30-something women -- and her colleague David Popenoe undertook the study because of a common lament among women: Men don't seem to be interested in getting hitched these days.

"The whole debate about commitment-phobic men has reached a high point in the popular cultures," Whitehead says. "It's talked about in books and movies. It's an ongoing conversation piece among a lot of young women today. We decided no one had really asked the men to see if there was anything to it."

The researchers divided 60 unmarried, heterosexual men aged 25 to 33 from four cities across the United States into eight focus groups. The men were asked to discuss their attitudes about such topics as sex, dating, meeting women, living together and social pressures to marry and divorce.

The most often reason cited for delaying marriage was men's ease in getting sex. Next was enjoying the benefits of marriage by living together.

The other eight most commonly cited reasons men gave for dodging matrimony were:

1 They want to avoid divorce and its financial risks

2 They want to wait until they are older to have children

3 They fear that marriage will require too many changes and compromises

4 They are waiting for the perfect soul mate and she hasn't yet appeared

5 They face few social pressures to marry

6 They are reluctant to marry a woman who already has children

7 They want to own a house before they get a wife

8 They want to enjoy single life as long as they can

None of the men in the focus groups expressed a burning desire for children, Whitehead adds. Most saw children as a remote life goal, and a responsibility they weren't ready to deal with yet.

"If this trend of men waiting to marry continues, it is likely to clash with the timing of marriage and childbearing for the many young women who hope to marry and bear children before they begin to face problems associated with declining fertility," Popenoe says.

Indeed, the medium age of marriage has been rising for both men and women. In 1960, it was about 23 years for men and 20 for women. In 2000, it was about 27 for men and 25 for women, according to recent U.S, Census figures.

For college-educated men and women, Whitehead believes it is later still.

She says she was especially surprised at reasons men gave for their fear of divorce. They didn't talk about the emotional havoc it can wreak, but about the money troubles it could cause. Specifically, they worried an ex-wife could clean them out financially.

"Men have a fear of divorce because it will really hit them in the pocketbook," Whitehead says. "This concern contributes to their preference for cohabitation because they want to protect their assets. They figure, why in the world would you marry if you have the same deal by living with someone without the risk of losing your money?"

However, Dorian Solot, executive director of the Alternatives to Marriage Project, says she believes the study is misleading and too hard on men.

"In every public-opinion poll we're aware of and our own research, women are the ones really questioning marriage and men are the ones more interested in getting married," says Solot, who runs the organization with her live-in boyfriend in Boston.

Among the surveys she cites to bolster her view:

A 1996 Gallup poll found that 39 percent of unmarried men would prefer to be married, compared to 29 percent of unmarried women.

A survey of high schoolers from 1996 to 2000 found 38 percent of senior boys believed marriage leads to a fuller and happier life, compared to 29 percent of senior girls.
"If there is one gender more commitment-phobic than the other, it's probably women," Solot says.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=97&u=/hsn/20020724/hl_hsn/why_men_don_t_hear_wedding_bells&printer=1

Foul Temptress
07-25-2002, 09:48 AM
That is very interesting..Thanks for posting the article.

Manu
07-25-2002, 11:27 AM
The most often reason cited for delaying marriage was men's ease in getting sex.
I think I need to move to those cities where those guys live, lol.

That said, I find it interesting that a lot of the 'other' reasons cited were seemingly 'good' reasons, such as wanting to own a house, having not found that soul mate, worried about divorce and financial risks (which to me lends itself heavily to not really being in love)

It at the very least points a more 3 dimensional picture of men.

I wonder what women's 'new roll' in the household has to play with the changing dynamics of marriage. Does the fact that many women work, or there are many single mothers, or any myriad of changes since the 50s, 60s, and how they effect the marriage aspects of relationships.

turtle_o
07-25-2002, 11:54 AM
isnt living together and not getting married just the easiest way to have your cake and eat it too?

i think some of the other reasons are bunch of crap.. i mean a guy would live with a girl, but he wouldnt marry her until he bought a house... you're already together anyways, what's the difference.

anyways, living together w/out having that intent to marry, is just a bit too easy for guys i think. ;)

QtrHrsmn
07-25-2002, 12:12 PM
Originally posted by turtle_o
isnt living together and not getting married just the easiest way to have your cake and eat it too?

i think some of the other reasons are bunch of crap.. i mean a guy would live with a girl, but he wouldnt marry her until he bought a house... you're already together anyways, what's the difference.

anyways, living together w/out having that intent to marry, is just a bit too easy for guys i think. ;) Ummm... if women wouldn't get so offended by a pre-nup... it might not be such a problem.


DIVORCE: the fastest way to make the most beautiful woman turn into the greediest shrew.

Manu
07-25-2002, 12:44 PM
Alex-

I think the issues with a prenup are, is that it feels like a condemnation from the begining.

I KNOW that people chang ewhen marriages go on and when divorces happen, as you said, people become money grubbing, but the prenup, though a protection, says 'if we break up' when in a marriage, I hope I go into mine KNOWING we won't...

Again, prenup is realistic, and I am trying to be idealistic, and I know thats not the best...

But im just trying to give perspective...

Allegra
07-25-2002, 01:01 PM
I agree with you Manu.

I'll never sign a pre-nup because I'll never go into a marriage with reservations -- and that is exactly what a pre-nup spells out. For me, it will be unneccesary. I also hope that the man I marry will understand my true colors -- and will know that if we ever did get divorced, I would never financially drain him.

Sure, maybe it is idealistic. But we spend too much time trying to remove whim and fancy from our everyday lives. Why does everything have to be so black and white? So grounded in realism? If you can't thoroughly love being in love -- what's left?

turtle_o
07-25-2002, 01:11 PM
i wouldnt sign a prenup because i am making a committment, not only am i hoping it will last forever, but in truth, i would work DAMN hard not to let the marriage die.

I'm a slacker in many ways, but there some things that i seem to inherently know how to work at, and relationships seem to be one of them. *shrug*

Also if i follow my gut, and can honestly say I'm getting married the right reasons there should be no reason we cant work through anything.

(anyone who is older, please dont get on my case, I'm only 21, and allow me to dream for a lil while... I'll figure it out on my own ;) )

Redfield
07-25-2002, 01:23 PM
For me, living together would've meant that I would be offered a chance to spend the rest of my life with the woman I wanted as my partner and marriage gives me the chance to confirm it.

Marriage is a symbol of the amount of dedication one is willing to devote to a relationship. A pre-nup would, IMO, through all of that symbolism and sentiment out the window.

When career, school, differences of opinions are enough to make one doubt marriage, maybe that person should consider living with their partner first. But that's another thread. :D

QtrHrsmn
07-25-2002, 01:25 PM
yes, but in today's moral climate, Manu, the average marriage lasts 10 years.... or less. so I actually think it wiser to wait until you're a little older to get married, AND to already own your home.... because what you bring INTO the marriage, you can reasonably expect to take back out of it.

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