Where is my old hero of the past? I guess he proved his point to the USA and all who wanted to listen. It's understandable that the motor industry would hate that he showed them up for what they are but why do some everyday citizens dislike him. He did more good for the consuming public than anyone I know of, and yet...... :confused:

Dear Ralph,

Please STAY THE **** IN WHATEVER HOLE YOU'RE IN.

Sincerely,
America

Actually, the " Unsafe at Any Speed" which zeroed in on the Corvair was totally unfair. By the time the book was published GM was aware of the "tuck-under" problem with the rear suspension and started to design and modify subsequent models.
Nader's efforts actually killed the most advanced auto on US roads at that time and put Detroit back on the "tried and true" path that allowed the Japanese to bring in more technically advanced models and steal the market.

What they said.

Actually, the " Unsafe at Any Speed" which zeroed in on the Corvair was totally unfair. By the time the book was published GM was aware of the "tuck-under" problem with the rear suspension and started to design and modify subsequent models.
Nader's efforts actually killed the most advanced auto on US roads at that time and put Detroit back on the "tried and true" path that allowed the Japanese to bring in more technically advanced models and steal the market.

Where is Nader? I think he's probably abusing some of his employees...

In any case, yes, I think your assessment is essentially correct. The Corvair was all about innovation. For those who think Nader "exposed the auto industry for what they are", I just have to say that there is no car on the road today that is 100% safe. There never will be. Perhaps one could be designed and built, but I doubt anyone could afford it. Therefore, of what good would such a product be?

There are cases where a design is proven to be faulty. However, with computer simulation and crash testing these days those instances become more and more rare. I don't think any industry hell bent on killing their customers is going to last long and the auto industry knows that.

Dear Ralph,

Please STAY THE **** IN WHATEVER HOLE YOU'RE IN.

Sincerely,
America

What is that all about. Anyway, to answer the question presented in the title of this thread: I don't know where Ralph is, but I recall him saying that another run for president is in the cards if Hillary wins the Democrat nomination.

What is that all about.

Precisely this:

I recall him saying that another run for president is in the cards if Hillary wins the Democrat nomination.

Precisely this:

Oh. I voted for Nader in '04. I'd take him over Hill, Bush, Kerry.

Oh. I voted for Nader in '04. I'd take him over Hill, Bush, Kerry.

Yes, well, he has no chance, so all he is good for is potentially ruining another 8 years.

Nader's efforts actually killed the most advanced auto on US roads at that time and put Detroit back on the "tried and true" path that allowed the Japanese to bring in more technically advanced models and steal the market.Wow... I knew he was anti-Corvair, but hadn't heard any of those details. Any sources (other than Unsafe at any Speed) you recommend on this topic?

Oh, and I hope he stays out of the '08 election. It's Ron Paul's turn to pee in the pool.

It really doesn't matter all that much whether a Democrat or a Republican is in office but it would make a big difference if Ralph or someone with his intelligence and guts could get into power but the powers that be would never allow it.
Why is it that the best people always get blasted?

Why is it that the best people always get blasted?

Because this:

It really doesn't matter all that much whether a Democrat or a Republican is in office

is not true.

Actually, the " Unsafe at Any Speed" which zeroed in on the Corvair was totally unfair.

I owned three of them; they were pieces of crap, and they had notorious exhaust problems with carbon monoxide leaks. The VW Beetle was a much better and simpler car. The US needs to allow them to be sold here again.

Actually, the " Unsafe at Any Speed" which zeroed in on the Corvair was totally unfair. By the time the book was published GM was aware of the "tuck-under" problem with the rear suspension and started to design and modify subsequent models.
Nader's efforts actually killed the most advanced auto on US roads at that time and put Detroit back on the "tried and true" path that allowed the Japanese to bring in more technically advanced models and steal the market.

People talk about "Unsafe at Any Speed" as if it were the only thing he ever did. That is nothing compared to what he did for consumers who were being hit with all sorts of crapola in many other areas where our health and lives were being compromised.
Better technically advanced models will steal the market any time. If Detroit had not sold it's soul to greed in the 60s and been more concerned with safety it would have done better.

Yes, well, he has no chance, so all he is good for is potentially ruining another 8 years.

Bush ruined more than 8 years. Ralph Nader knew he had no chance of winning the election and he knows it now. His goal and purpose is to make a point and he made it and will have to make it again but I don't think the people deserve him. They never do when someone ahead of his time comes along. What a loss.

they were pieces of crap

I owned three of them;

:eek3:

:eek3:

They were cheap. They didn't last long, however, so I didn't have to worry about them. They were disposables.

I hear ya... I was just joking around. :)

The benefits of what Ralph Nader did are in effect today. Other politicians used/stole his ideas and used them when running for office and in this election also. Listen to Obama promising to get rid on lobbyists and have big corporations pay higher taxes. Those are the ideas of Ralph Nader.
But, I hope Obama is elected--he is the only hope for any real progress and it is just hope. All the others would be a repetition of the past.

Of the field, I may be beginning to lean toward Obama. He strikes me as the least filthy (homage to Snouter).

It really doesn't matter all that much whether a Democrat or a Republican is in office but it would make a big difference if Ralph or someone with his intelligence and guts could get into power but the powers that be would never allow it.
Why is it that the best people always get blasted?

The powers that be have little to do with it. It's the voters that have refused to endorse him. However, an interesting test would see Nader winning the dem primary....then wait and see which way the delegates choose to vote at their convention.

There have already been some rumblings about the Hillary campaign...in that if she needed the votes from Iowa, the superdelegates to that state would give them to her, regardless how the primary vote went.

However, an interesting test would see Nader winning the dem primary....then wait and see which way the delegates choose to vote at their convention.

There have already been some rumblings about the Hillary campaign...in that if she needed the votes from Iowa, the superdelegates to that state would give them to her, regardless how the primary vote went.

Yes, and this is true for both parties. Primaries are merely demographic studies, wherein the results are used to make up the most marketable package to put out in these fake 'elections'. Nothing the unwashed masses ever vote on is in any way binding. State referendums on unimportant issues, like 'gay marriage', etc. can be in certain cases, but other than examples like that, nothing on a national level means jack. The bulk of the 'people's will' ends up with a few unfunded 'mandates', followed by lip service.

The powers that be have little to do with it.

I disagree with this; the powers that be are the only voters who matter; the rest is all PR and media showmanship.

Both 'sides', the faux 'Left', owned by billionare currency speculators, lawyers, insurance companies, ethno-centric racist lobbies, and the faux 'right', owned by oil companies, monopolists, big banking, 'defense' industries, etc., and both 'sides' lined up with labor racketeers and international organized crime syndicates and arms dealers, and miscellaneous sociopaths and psychos of all stripes, are never going to allow anything like an 'independent' get anywhere near their Federal Treasury piggy bank and welfare 'programs.' Just isn't going to happen, no way. They truly consider this country their own personal property, not 'the peoples''.

I disagree with this; the powers that be are the only voters who matter; the rest is all PR and media showmanship.

Both 'sides', the faux 'Left', owned by billionare currency speculators, lawyers, insurance companies, ethno-centric racist lobbies, and the faux 'right', owned by oil companies, monopolists, big banking, 'defense' industries, etc., and both 'sides' lined up with labor racketeers and international organized crime syndicates and arms dealers, and miscellaneous sociopaths and psychos of all stripes, are never going to allow anything like an 'independent' get anywhere near their Federal Treasury piggy bank and welfare 'programs.' Just isn't going to happen, no way. They truly consider this country their own personal property, not 'the peoples''.[/QUOTE]

Bingo! F,L. If someone, say, Ralph Nader, was in danger of being elected or did get elected I think he'd be in danger. Look back through history--so many 'advanced beyond their time' have 'bit the dust'. They wanted to bring change and that's a no, no. But change does come eventually--at a price.

There's a Corvair ragtop for sale on a guy's front lawn not far from me. I'm mighty tempted, but the budget won't run to it :mad: