During times of universal deceit , telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act ....George Orwell [ I can relate ] :nice:

A republic must either preserve it's virtue or lose it's Liberty ....John Witherspoon

It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system , for if they did , I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow moring ..... Henry Ford

Civilazation begins with order grows with Liberty and dies with chaos....Will Duran

When the government fears the people . That is Liberty , when the people fears the government,that is tyranny...Thomas Jefferson

Very good quotes. I especially like the first one. :nice:

(edit to add) The first one made me think of another, different kind of quote - "speak the truth in love" (something i need to keep in mind)

They're all quite insightful. Althought they're probably insightful in my mind in a slightly different way than in yours, pappy.

Very good quotes. I especially like the first one. :nice:

(edit to add) The first one made me think of another, different kind of quote - "speak the truth in love" (something i need to keep in mind)


Sometimes 'love' can mean death and misery .

A nation of sheep [ love ] will beet a government of wolves ....forgot who said it .

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak and timid ....Dwight D. Eisenhower
:nice:

They're all quite insightful. Althought they're probably insightful in my mind in a slightly different way than in yours, pappy.


You have to start somewhere, Igo .:nice:

Sometimes 'love' can mean death and misery .

A nation of sheep [ love ] will beet a government of wolves ....forgot who said it .

History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak and timid ....Dwight D. Eisenhower
:nice:

Love doesn't = weak and timid.

Besides, with that quote I wasn't talking about government or politics, just about speaking the truth.

Love doesn't = weak and timid.

Besides, with that quote I wasn't talking about government or politics, just about speaking the truth.


I understand what your saying, and also know that i have a less than humble way of speaking out . But it's us fighters who allow you peaceniks an opportunity to speak so 'peacefully ' , and to be globetrotting deciples . I think we need you hear, but thats just my opinion . keep in mind it was christians who died fighting for the independance of this nation . If they had not of fought, you could not be so loving .

I still think your basically a good person and not trying to offend ou ,just stating my opinion .

You have to start somewhere, Igo .:nice:
that's not at all what I meant. :p

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear." ---Marcus Tullius Cicero

"In a state of tranquillity, wealth, and luxury, our descendants would
forget the arts of war and the noble activity and zeal which made their
ancestors invincible. Every art of corruption would be employed to loosen
the bond of union which renders our resistance formidable. When the spirit of liberty which now animates our hearts and gives success to our arms is extinct, our numbers will accelerate our ruin and render us easier victims to tyranny." --Samuel Adams

"Liberty will not long survive the total extinction of morals." --Samuel
Adams

"None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love
not freedom, but license."--John Milton

"Patriotism is as much a virtue as justice, and is as necessary for
the support of societies as natural affection is for the support of
families." --Dr. Benjamin Rush

"Liberty exists in proportion to wholesome restraint." --Daniel Webster

"The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any price,
peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty first, the love
of soft living and the get-rich-quick theory of life." --Theodore
Roosevelt

"Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word:
equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality
in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude."-Alexis de Tocqueville

During times of universal deceit , telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act ....George Orwell [ I can relate ] :nice:

You do know that Orwell was shot and wounded in Catalonia while fighting for the Anarchist POUM militia, right? And that for much of WW2 he asserted that Britain's only hope of victory came in embracing a socialist revolution, right?

I always find it comical how much of the extreme right quote Orwell without thinking about the example he set and recorded in Down and Out in Paris and London, The Road To Wigan Pier and Homage to Catalonia.

Also to quote Orwell:

In our time it is broadly true that political writing is bad writing. Where it is not true, it will generally be found that the writer is some kind of rebel, expressing his private opinions and not a "party line." Orthodoxy, of whatever color, seems to demand a lifeless, imitative style. The political dialects to be found in pamphlets, leading articles, manifestoes, White papers and the speeches of undersecretaries do, of course, vary from party to party, but they are all alike in that one almost never finds in them a fresh, vivid, homemade turn of speech. When one watches some tired hack on the platform mechanically repeating the familiar phrases -- bestial, atrocities, iron heel, bloodstained tyranny, free peoples of the world, stand shoulder to shoulder -- one often has a curious feeling that one is not watching a live human being but some kind of dummy: a feeling which suddenly becomes stronger at moments when the light catches the speaker's spectacles and turns them into blank discs which seem to have no eyes behind them. And this is not altogether fanciful. A speaker who uses that kind of phraseology has gone some distance toward turning himself into a machine. The appropriate noises are coming out of his larynx, but his brain is not involved as it would be if he were choosing his words for himself. If the speech he is making is one that he is accustomed to make over and over again, he may be almost unconscious of what he is saying, as one is when one utters the responses in church. And this reduced state of consciousness, if not indispensable, is at any rate favorable to political conformity.

In our time, political speech and writing are largely the defense of the indefensible. Things like the continuance of British rule in India, the Russian purges and deportations, the dropping of the atom bombs on Japan, can indeed be defended, but only by arguments which are too brutal for most people to face, and which do not square with the professed aims of the political parties. Thus political language has to consist largely of euphemism., question-begging and sheer cloudy vagueness.

"Like sands through the hourglass, so are the day's of our lives" Bill and Ted.

During times of universal deceit , telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act ....George Orwell [ I can relate ] :nice:


"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear." ---Marcus Tullius Cicero

Those two describe the current situation very, very well. Especially the last one. The way the enemy within has infected the body politic, from the very halls of government itself, using an accent familiar to his victims, and has worked pretty hard to rot the souls of our nation -- working secretly to undermine the pillars of our liberty. Unfortunately, the fools, though we've survived them long enough alone, ran out and voted him back into office.

The way the enemy within has infected the body politic

Too, true. Today, we call them Democrats. We USED to call them foreign enemies and socialists. Now they have subsumed a formerly American political Party.

Too, true. Today, we call them Democrats. We USED to call them foreign enemies and socialists. Now they have subsumed a formerly American political Party.

Unfortunately that disease has also infected the Republican Party as well as some are all for granting amnesty for illegal aliens, erasing our national borders, and surrendering our national sovereignty to a North American Union.

Too, true. Today, we call them Democrats.
And Republicans. And lobbyists.

Those two describe the current situation very, very well. Especially the last one. The way the enemy within has infected the body politic, from the very halls of government itself, using an accent familiar to his victims, and has worked pretty hard to rot the souls of our nation -- working secretly to undermine the pillars of our liberty. Unfortunately, the fools, though we've survived them long enough alone, ran out and voted him back into office.



I was on of those fools, thinking anything better than Kerry, but I was wrong to setle for seemed like lessor evil . Now they are pasing a law that can get us locked away for saying this . We are probably already on their shit list .

I called 202-456-1111 today and told Bush to release the two border agents Remos and Compein . I told him to tell the president those agents were only doing what he refused to do. He laughed and said he would tell him .

Call this number and tell bush to pardon these two who were doing their jobs . This criminal also had 700 lbs of pot . Got shot in ass and now suing the gov for FIVE MILLION !

And Republicans. And lobbyists.


See boss, your learning . Stick with me and you'll go places , like one of the nice gulag they have all over the nation now . I hear clinton built a real big one in Alaska , sleeps a million ! .:nice: Hope it's all a rumor ! :confused:

:rofl: I'm not sticking to anything that has anything to do with you. You opitimize much of what I hate about being human. Luckily, in this country, that's your right, and I hope it stays that way.

:rofl: I'm not sticking to anything that has anything to do with you. You opitimize much of what I hate about being human. Luckily, in this country, that's your right, and I hope it stays that way.

:confused: What you hate is the shithole you've been left with and I had nothing to do with it ,sonny. I tried to stop it not for you nessasarily,but for my kids ,grandkids and then you . :nice: . Anyway I was joking with you earlier, but since it can cost me another one of your warnings ,I'll just ignore your insults and consider the source .

Insult me all you want, paps, I'll never warn you for insulting me. The people you gladly toss in the shithole are some of my best friends and have been more supportive and loving than anyone you've ever known. This is why your world view is and always will be contrary to mine. You write people off as trash for being themselves, when being themselves harms absolutely no one.

One thing I want to comment on specifically:
I had nothing to do with it
Absolutely you did. The reason we have gay pride parades is not because gays want to be flamboyant and "in your face" to people that love them for the people they are. They are reacting to the people that make them feel like human shit. They are reacting to people that hate them without knowing them. They are reacting to people like you. "You're gay? I don't care" doesn't create a reality where people need to force their lifestyle on you to make you accept it.

And lobbyists.

Wrong. Lobbyists are almost more quintessentially American than either of the parties. The Federalist Papers sets up their role almost from the beginning as advocates for their factions, interests, guilds, merchant associations, etc.

The thought that lobbying is not truly American is NOT correct at all.

Wow. I didn't think even you would say that.

Insult me all you want, paps, I'll never warn you for insulting me. The people you gladly toss in the shithole are some of my best friends and have been more supportive and loving than anyone you've ever known. This is why your world view is and always will be contrary to mine. You write people off as trash for being themselves, when being themselves harms absolutely no one.

One thing I want to comment on specifically:

Absolutely you did. The reason we have gay pride parades is not because gays want to be flamboyant and "in your face" to people that love them for the people they are. They are reacting to the people that make them feel like human shit. They are reacting to people that hate them without knowing them. They are reacting to people like you. "You're gay? I don't care" doesn't create a reality where people need to force their lifestyle on you to make you accept it.


Are you queer ? I didn't know you were if you are . That exsplains alot . I have said it before and I will say it again , I don't care how you get your kicks, just keep the filth in the queer population and out of the schools . Why don't you ask some of these ass kissers here if they wouldnt mind their sons and daughters being showed how to have anal sex point blank ? Would they sacrifice their young to the politicle correct alter ? No matter how many parades you have most people find it wrong . They are closet bigots .

Soon we will be destroyed because of our evil ways . Either by muslim rule , cival war or nukes ,either way it will be because we believed a lie that good is bad and bad is good . You can hate me because of my lifestyle,but I'm suppose to love yours ? :confused:

This thread wasn't about homos,it was about the opposite . So why would a mod highjack it ,change subject and bait me ? Igo,give yourself a warning . Make that 3 warnings .

Are you queer ?
Nope, I love women.
I don't care how you get your kicks,
That's great to hear. If only it were true. If you don't care, then stop being a bitch to people that live differently than you.
just keep the filth in the queer population and out of the schools .
98% of the people do. For some reason you hear about the 2% that do ****ed up things and condemn the other 98% for their actions.
You can hate me because of my lifestyle,but I'm suppose to love yours ? :confused:
No, you can hate me all you want. Just leave me alone.
This thread wasn't about homos,it was about the opposite . So why would a mod highjack it ,change subject and bait me ? Igo,give yourself a warning . Make that 3 warnings .
Done and done.

...then stop being a bitch to people that live differently than you.


Wait a minute! If THAT becomes a rule I wouldn't have NO fun at all, man!

Yer killin' me!

i read that there is a gov watch for words being used like ,patriot, consttution revolution, 1st.amendment ,etc. Anyone else read this ? Or are any of you one of them ?

... if so, they JUST got YOU, man!

Speak truth to power, dude.

POWER TO DA PIPPLES!!